Funny

[BHarvey]

that people actually believe today's cars are more efficient than 20+ years ago.
I had 2 different 1985 model cars that would both exceed 50 mpg hwy. One was a Corolla that was carb'd and I routinely got 51-53 on the hwy and 37-40 combined. The other was a diesel Jetta (non-turbo) that would get 50+ combined and 60 on the hwy. I once drove that one from Atlanta to Mt.Airy NC, drove around all week, then drove back to Atlanta on ONE tank. The Jetta had maybe 40 HP so you were WFO ALL the time.

A diesel/electric, like a locomotive, would probably net 300+ mpg, and we know it can be done. At very least, if the US was at all concerned about the oil problem, then we would take it upon ourselves to see that traffic lights were designed to work in a half way efficient manner, and lower the speed limit, at very least.

[brucey]

Cars are more efficient today. The prius can beat those numbers (51/48/50 mpg hwy/city/combined) even with it weighing 700 lbs more than the 85 corolla. (2300 and 3000 manufacturer listed curb weights)

The first gen Honda insight is listed at 500 lbs less than the 85 corolla, but was rated for 70 mpg in 1999. (EPA)

They did limit speed limits before. It didn't do anything. The DOT conducted studies saying it only helped reduce gasoline consumption by 2% , other studies showed even less. (Wikipedia link: National Maximum Speed Law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia )

That said, I agree with you. If we were all as crazy about saving fuel as some of us are here, it would not be a problem. But a problem-less world would just be so boring, ya know?

[pounsfos]

you've got to remember that the difference between old cars and new ones is

did the old cars have air conditioning (CLIMATE CONTROL)
did they have ABS and all that jazz,
could you fit 4 people COMFORTABLY in the corolla

even though new cars get the same or if not less fuel economy than 20 years ago, back then they didnt have half the safety features etc than they do today. thats the problem,

my 1982 starlet for example, goodluck fitting 4 people in it, compared to a new car that gets 40mpg and can
my starlet doesnt have any safety features, so if i crash im f$#ked but im a good driver so ive avoided heaps of incidents. my starlets climate control is the window

(not dissing the corrolla just saying my 2c)

[star_deceiver]

Originally Posted by pounsfos

did the old cars have air conditioning (CLIMATE CONTROL)
did they have ABS and all that jazz,
could you fit 4 people COMFORTABLY in the corolla

Well... my car doesn't have A/C.
I drive with the traction control and VSC off (at least in winter).
1 passenger is too many!!!

But I also believe that my Twinstar has less safety features then your Starlet

[nemo]

Originally Posted by BHarvey

At very least, if the US was at all concerned about the oil problem, then we would take it upon ourselves to see that traffic lights were designed to work in a half way efficient manner, and lower the speed limit, at very least.

I agree with the traffic lights. The lights were I live all function independently of each other. I especially like it when they stop a whole line of on coming traffic for nothing not even a car on the side street.

[Frank Lee]

I especially like it when they stop a whole line of on coming traffic for nothing not even a car on the side street.

I enjoy that too, coupled with all the new "development" that has added 5x more lights/stop signs per unit of road than there used to be. Yup, nice'n'efficient.

[vtec-e]

Originally Posted by nemo

I agree with the traffic lights. The lights were I live all function independently of each other. I especially like it when they stop a whole line of on coming traffic for nothing not even a car on the side street.

Oh boy, that is so bleedin annoying! Wait, isn't this the conspiracy theory forum??.....

[gone-ot]

Originally Posted by vtec-e

Oh boy, that is so bleedin annoying! Wait, isn't this the conspiracy theory forum??.....

...well, it becomes a conspiracy if more than three posters are on at the same time...

...one, two, thr.............................................ee

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by pounsfos

could you fit 4 people COMFORTABLY in the corolla

But do I WANT to fit four people in a car, comfortably or not? No.

[Arragonis]

I won a car a few years back, an old Metro (MG stylee) from 1982. It came with an old 1275cc OHV with 72hp and gearing of 17.3 mph / 1000 rpm in top (4th). I had to collect it from London and drive it back to Edinburgh. It did the journey well at quite a good lick of speed ~75-85 all the way. It did 35 mpg too.

At the time I had a FIAT Bravo 1.6 with 100 hp and 20 mph/1000 rpm in top. It used to return 35 mpg whenever I went on longer trips. It was also a LOT heavier and had more gadgets - air con, PAS, ABS etc.

It seemed to me that the efficiency gains of a modern engine, FI etc. had been put into adding performance and space and not into increasing FE.

The big killer seems to be weight though. That Metro had a curb weight of about 1800 lbs and it was a near top of the range model for 1982. The new C1 has a weight of pretty much the same. And to get to that weight it was purposely designed to keep the flab off.