"Green" Batteries

[Flakbadger]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

Aren't the manufacturers and importers responsible to ensure them a correct final destination?

No?

There are abandoned tires all over the place in the forests around here. People buy a set of tires off Craigslist or whatever and ditch the old ones in the woods. You can seriously find hundreds of them if you look.

[sheepdog 44]

Zebra molten salt battery? It says they are not toxic and recyclable. There are a ton of different battery chemistries to pick from in the link.

I'd take a deeper look into the mining of any battery. The elemental makeup may be non toxic, but how they are mined could be environmentally horrific.

Weird and Wonderful Batteries - Battery University

Unfortunately these tires have no useful life. Someone didn't need them and didn't want to pay to get rid of them. Then just rolled them into the forest. I've seen some with old timey white sidewalls.

[Ryland]

Originally Posted by jeff88

Just because it is recyclable and/or recycled, does not mean it is non-toxic. Believe me, I would rather them be recycled, but what I am wondering is if there is an environmentally friendly, non-toxic battery that can also be recycled. You mention these facilities that do everything in their power to not pollute the chemicals, because they know how toxic it would be if it was polluted into the ground. I'm not saying that is a bad thing and I am glad they do it, but if we had a non-toxic battery, that would not be as required.

Lead that is in the environment and causing problems does not tend to be from lead acid batteries even tho most of the lead that is used world wide is used in lead acid batteries either in use or in recycling of them and most of the lead going in to new batteries is from recycled batteries, demand keeps increasing of course.

I can think of a few, but what is the accepted meaning of "industry"? An organic, sustainable farm would be a nice place to live next to. Would you put a farm under the industry tab? What about an FSC forest farm and/or mill?

I get what you're saying about the potato battery, but wouldn't any battery of any kind still require some sort of (heavy) metals, which would at least put it on par with any other battery (at least in terms of toxicity)? Also, copper is highly recycled, so you would only have to worry about the zinc (I know copper is still mined, but you could presumably used recycled copper).

I am under the impression that in a battery like a potato battery that the metals are consumed as part of the function of the battery, that they are not rechargeable and that it's a one way chemical reaction.

Nickle in nickle based batteries is a more valuable metal because it's not as common, copper is already on the list of metals that we will run out of on the next 30-40 years and the price of nickle is much higher then copper already so it's either less common or harder to get.

[Daekar]

Don't worry about your lead-acid batteries being bad for the environment. Recycle them properly, and rest assured that a significant portion of the lead used in new batteries comes from the old ones. This is far better for the environment than the mining, processing, smelting, and manufacture of a lithium battery, for instance. In this case, the existing technology is actually quite effective, and cost-effective to boot, at doing its job.

[euromodder]

More lead from batteries is being recycled, than new lead being mined ...

[Sven7]

Originally Posted by sheepdog 44

Anyone know what i could do with a tire? I know of about a dozen scattered in different state parks.

Drill three holes in each, string some heavy nylon rope into the holes, tie em off on the top and bottom and sell em for $20 a piece on Craigslists as "repurposed" tire swings.

[IamIan]

Originally Posted by Awd180

The greenest battery though least efficient is a potato.

How about an Electric Eel?

It doesn't even need the refined metals for the anode and cathode that the potato battery does.

Up to 600V and 500W ... from each ~22kg "Eel Cell"... Put electrically in parallel for more watts of power , or longer durations of power.

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Although I wonder if in the long term / plant wide basis ... would be nuclear cells ... Over all across the whole planet the same amount of radiation will be emitted by the radioactive decay ... weather it is harnessed in a battery or not.

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Non-Toxic capacitors ... might also be an alternative ... although harmful things can be used to increase performance ... a lower preforming capacitor can be made from completely non-toxic 'green' materials.

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Trees can also produce small voltages ... as a type of battery ... due to the potential difference created by photosynthesis ... even more so twice a year when the sap flows to or from the roots.

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There is also a variation on the 'earth' battery ... not getting it's majority from the decomposition of dismillar metals but instead ... tapping into the earth's ... telluric current ... again small voltages ... but it re-charges naturally all by itself ... and no toxic components can be used for such devices.

[guudasitgets]

I worked for a battery company. The cost of recycling the Prius and other NMH and Li batteries is much higher and deals with more harmful chemicals the lead acid battery recycling. Lead acid batteries are, for the most part almost all recycled, plates, lead grids, plate tab burns, polypropylene cases, heck even the stainless studs on golf cart batteries. The first two require electrolysis to un-clad various metals used. If you want recycling efficiency you cant beat lead acid as compared to the NiCad, NMH or Li group. This was a concern when I found out Toyota was doing their own recycling program and every one was ok with it because it was taken care of by the factory. But at what cost to the environment. I know these are changing times and we all have a little Li battery in our cell phones and soon cars but years down the road we must examine what all these things are going to do when they end up in landfills, on the sides of roads etc. There are some operational benefits to other types. NiCad standby starting batteries for gen sets are rated to last 20 years before replacement, so they get used less therefore don't have to recycle as often. Li, improves performance in colder temps, (so they say) I haven't tested it myself but will this year on the sled in the winter. The answer to the greenest battery? Model T ford, with a hand crank and a magneto, it didn't need one. Had one just for the starting coils.

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by guudasitgets

I worked for a battery company. The cost of recycling the Prius and other NMH and Li batteries is much higher and deals with more harmful chemicals the lead acid battery recycling. Lead acid batteries are, for the most part almost all recycled, plates, lead grids, plate tab burns, polypropylene cases, heck even the stainless studs on golf cart batteries. The first two require electrolysis to un-clad various metals used. If you want recycling efficiency you cant beat lead acid as compared to the NiCad, NMH or Li group. This was a concern when I found out Toyota was doing their own recycling program and every one was ok with it because it was taken care of by the factory. But at what cost to the environment. I know these are changing times and we all have a little Li battery in our cell phones and soon cars but years down the road we must examine what all these things are going to do when they end up in landfills, on the sides of roads etc. There are some operational benefits to other types. NiCad standby starting batteries for gen sets are rated to last 20 years before replacement, so they get used less therefore don't have to recycle as often. Li, improves performance in colder temps, (so they say) I haven't tested it myself but will this year on the sled in the winter. The answer to the greenest battery? Model T ford, with a hand crank and a magneto, it didn't need one. Had one just for the starting coils.

Yes lead is super easy to recycle separate the lead, plastic and steel bits melt off the lead and smelt the lead oxide and lead sulfate plates thus turning them back into lead. Its 100+ year old technology so you know its got to be simple.
LiFePO4 batteries kind of suck in the cold. This year should be a better test, I think my suburban's starter might have been starting to fail.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Graphene batteries are quoted to be the "cleanest" ones, altough they don't have the same energy storage density of a Lithium battery. But their cost might still be a good option to eventually replace Lead-acid batteries for their current applications.

Originally Posted by guudasitgets

I worked for a battery company. The cost of recycling the Prius and other NMH and Li batteries is much higher and deals with more harmful chemicals the lead acid battery recycling. Lead acid batteries are, for the most part almost all recycled, plates, lead grids, plate tab burns, polypropylene cases, heck even the stainless studs on golf cart batteries. The first two require electrolysis to un-clad various metals used. If you want recycling efficiency you cant beat lead acid as compared to the NiCad, NMH or Li group. This was a concern when I found out Toyota was doing their own recycling program and every one was ok with it because it was taken care of by the factory. But at what cost to the environment.

That's why I still consider an old Diesel beater over a hybrid