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Old 11-19-2015, 03:26 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Think of the old triple and quadruple expansion steam engines, generate more electricity and use the existing distribution system. Any decent potential heat differential will get you there. Vary the working fluids as pressures drop. Running the next engine off this engines exhaust steam.

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Old 11-19-2015, 11:55 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I don't know but we are constantly building systems that include 2 water pipes coupled with 1 "gas" pipe all underground to every house in our area.
Constantly building? To every house? No, most houses are already built, with the supply lines installed decades ago. (Thus amortizing the cost over those decades.) Much more disruptive & expensive to dig up roads & landscaping to retrofit.

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One could assume the mission critical gas pipe would be omitted...
Still used for cooking.

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Another more radical thought, why not just use the existing pipes, the powerplant complex makes enough heat to heat 500,000 homes, more than are even in the area, why not just run all municipal water as hot through existing lines, the heat sync affect would eventually allow the water to be hot in most areas and to get cold water you would need a heat sync.
Because in most cases the powerplants are not located anywhere near the water sources? Because the energy & equipment needed to cool water would wipe out most of the hypothetical savings?
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Old 11-20-2015, 10:04 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Constantly building? To every house? No, most houses are already built, with the supply lines installed decades ago. (Thus amortizing the cost over those decades.) Much more disruptive & expensive to dig up roads & landscaping to retrofit.
Most of the new construction in our area is by the powerplant, most of our houses have been getting sewer water recently.

The water treatment plant and pump facilities are also right next to the powerplant as are a variety of businesses including a shopping mall and cheese factory that could use waste heat.

Just seems so foolish that the waste heat does nothing but make steam on the road and keep the river clear
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Old 11-20-2015, 12:51 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by rmay635703 View Post
Most of the new construction in our area is by the powerplant...
OK, that's you. I imagine this isn't the case, most places. So you don't have e.g. economies of scale in producing the equipment, or architects & construction workers who know how best to install it. Same basic problem as solar space heat & hot water, which is an even better alternative in many places.

Also, what happens to all those water-heated houses in 20 years or so, when emissions regulations, increasing cost of fossil fuel, and decreasing cost of solar/wind/whatever make the plant uneconomic to run?
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Old 11-20-2015, 01:58 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Obviously, you would still need water heaters, in case the water happened to not be hot enough, and then you would have hot water heaters!
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Old 11-20-2015, 07:37 PM   #16 (permalink)
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People don't set their standards high enough. A properly designed and constructed home (well insulated, with very high-tech glazing and an air-to-air heat exchanger) would be homeostatic (I made a pun!) and need power only for localized heat/cold shunting. And the grow lights.
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Old 11-20-2015, 08:13 PM   #17 (permalink)
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The problems there are payback time and the market.

The housing market values square feet, number of bathrooms, bedrooms and garages. I've never seen a real estate listing that even mentioned insulation or furnace type (unless it was to mention radiant in the floors of a room or two). It's hard for them to factor in the value of reduced heating costs in the price of the house.

Payback time hurts at construction time, just like with solar. Building in a lifetime of reduced heating and cooling expenses costs a lot right now, while the benefits trickle in very slowly, if they can ever be quantified directly. Banks don't like financing extra insulation costs because when the house gets sold, it still comes back to just how many bedrooms you've got.

When I'm rich and famous I'll have a passive house. Solar and ****. Until then I'm stuck in a regular house and I try to be efficient in it.
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Transmission type Efficiency
Manual neutral engine off.100% @MPG <----- Fun Fact.
Manual 1:1 gear ratio .......98%
CVT belt ............................88%
Automatic .........................86%

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Old 11-20-2015, 08:14 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Oops. I just got automatically censored. $#*+.
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Transmission type Efficiency
Manual neutral engine off.100% @MPG <----- Fun Fact.
Manual 1:1 gear ratio .......98%
CVT belt ............................88%
Automatic .........................86%

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Old 11-20-2015, 09:02 PM   #19 (permalink)
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If I had a genset at home I'd try co-generation.
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Old 11-21-2015, 04:08 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Building in a lifetime of reduced heating and cooling expenses costs a lot right now, while the benefits trickle in very slowly, if they can ever be quantified directly.
I lived for a number of years in a geodesic dome. It was the cleanest, warmest and quietest place I've ever lived—all qualities due to it's hemispherical shape. Dust only settles in corners, toroidal air circulation conserves heat and the shape dissipates exterior sounds. A streamlined exterior shell and solar and wind powered operation don't have to cost more up front.

I'm stuck too. It's 256sq ft which is nice, but it's a long skinny rectangle instead of a circle.

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