learning (teaching) to drive a manual transmission...

[TEiN]

Originally Posted by Katana

You're a driving instructor yourself Tein?

I instructed at various driving/racing schools from 1998 - 2004.

[some_other_dave]

Originally Posted by Katana

I don't know enough about the American driving tests to comment on their thoroughness or how they are done, care to enlighten me?

It varies some by state, but so far my experience is:

1 - You take a multiple-guess test on traffic laws and/or safety. The test takes anywhere up to about an hour, though I think you'd have to work hard to make it take more than 30 minutes. You have to score over 70% to pass. Anyone with a pulse should be able to get at least 50% correct.

2- You take a vision test to see if you have to wear glasses when you drive or not. In some cases, people must wear glasses at night but do not have to during the day.

3- You take a driving test that lasts about 15 minutes and checks the very most basic operational principles, and only some of those.

The driving test is only mandatory for people who are getting their licenses for the first time. That usually happens at age 16, and is pretty much a "rite of passage" in the US. Some states make you take driving tests every N years, while others don't seem to care about that part of it at all. Some are trying to impose a test every year for people over X age, but the little-old-lady lobby (the AARP) makes that difficult.

In the US, any idiot can get a driver's license. And most of them do.

-soD

[Christ]

Originally Posted by luvit

in the u.s. you get your license by mail order.

*facepalm*

It's not that bad, but close.

Every state in the US has different rules regarding licensure, but each state has a reciprocity agreement via federal endorsement of the driver examination procedure of every other state.

In PA, the test procedure differs based on age. If you're under 18, you get your permit via a test procedure of approximately (can't remember exactly how many) 15 questions. You only get 3 or maybe 5 wrong before you fail the written exam. The permit testing is the same for over 18, as well.

If you're under 18, on your permit, you have to have someone vouch for you (parent/guardian) that you've practiced at least 50 hours of on-road training, over a period of 6 months (180 days), and have completed all necessary steps of learning to drive according to state laws and regulations.

After that, you take the licensure test (on-road) test, which lasts only a few minutes, and usually is comprised of a parallel park, a few left turns, and a right turn, in traffic in most cases. All of the test is "major", so if you mess up pretty much anything, you've failed. The examiner gives point reductions based on nuances and finesse, as well, so you can stand to lose points, but not to mess up a maneuver. If you miss the parallel park, you don't get to do the road test.

You can fail 3 times, then you must retake the written test and re-obtain your permit.

If you're over 18 when you get your permit, you can literally find any other testing station that's open the next day and take your road test, as long as you have someone to vouch for your driving ability.

In either case, the person you drive with for practice must be 21 or older. They say you can't drive home from your license test legally, but many do anyway.

Renewal occurs every 4 years, and only requires that you send in paperwork, and if necessary, take a new license photo.

[SentraSE-R]

I took a written drivers license test in Colorado years ago. This old guy and younger woman got into the line of people waiting to get our answers graded, and started asking all of us for the answers to the questions. I got to an examiner's window and complained about the cheaters, pointing them out to the examiner.

He said he couldn't do much about it. If he flunked them, they'd just go somewhere else and cheat. I said I rode a motorcycle, and didn't want idiots like that on the road with me. He didn't do a thing.

[Christ]

Originally Posted by SentraSE-R

I took a written drivers license test in Colorado years ago. This old guy and younger woman got into the line of people waiting to get our answers graded, and started asking all of us for the answers to the questions. I got to an examiner's window and complained about the cheaters, pointing them out to the examiner.

He said he couldn't do much about it. If he flunked them, they'd just go somewhere else and cheat. I said I rode a motorcycle, and didn't want idiots like that on the road with me. He didn't do a thing.

That's another thing about PA - there are a bunch of different series of questions on the written test, so you could have one of 100 different tests (potentially), so asking "What's the answer to #3?" nets you about the same odds as guessing... 1 in 4.

[Rainh2o]

Here in michigan they require you to have a driving course and its a graduated license until your 18. I think its a scam to require to have a driving course that costs 200+ bucks personally. The graduated driving license they issue until 18 is OK, it basically restricts number of passengers, driving times and such, gets them use to driving right before just letting them loose like I was when I turned 16.

[Rainh2o]

Originally Posted by luvit

in the u.s. you get your license by mail order.

Thats funny...sometimes I think that might be right! when I learned way back in the day, you took a test if you wanted to study for it you could but you took a written test, if you passed, they examiner took you out basically around the block a couple of times, asked you to do a controlled stop and park. You got your license if you passed both. I drove to the examiners office and left with my license. Of course I had been driving on he farm for about 5 years before that so I did get marked for having some bad habits already...

[luvit]

Originally Posted by Rainh2o

..Of course I had been driving on he farm for about 5 years before that so I did get marked for having some bad habits already...

i also drove on the farm for years and may have had some bad habits. i also used a mercury lynx manual transmission.
i really believe i failed because of the m/t. the instructor said something like "you take you hand off the stick just a tad slow. i bet you'll never really take it off the stick because it looks so 'joe cool'" he failed me on my driving test based on how cool i looked.

[Ford Man]

In my own experience the best way to teach someone how to drive a stick is just as has been said before toss them the keys and let them get familiar with it on their own somewhere like a field where they are not affecting traffic or any one's safety. Although I had moved a few stick shift vehicles for friends, the way I actually learned to drive one was I went out and traded my automatic for a car with a stick shift and got in it and drove it home. It was either drive it home or leave there.

[TEiN]

Originally Posted by Ford Man

In my own experience the best way to teach someone how to drive a stick is just as has been said before toss them the keys and let them get familiar with it on their own

Hey Ford Man,

While I appreciate the concept of "sink or swim", there's a big difference between being able to do something, and being able to do it well. Learning by yourself in most cases precludes the latter. Not saying that it isn't possible, just that it isn't likely.