Nitrogen tires

[oil pan 4]

I think the only significance of the argon fill is a cheap trick to help get the car off the dealers lot. Beyond that I think it has little effect on the vehicle its self outside of f1 territory.

[ConnClark]

Originally Posted by CapriRacer

Well, I was hoping for a link to some test data.

Unfortunately the gas contributes probably less then 1% to the rolling resistance. So we will probably never see a paper with conclusive results.

It just doesn't make sense to me that different gases would behave differently as a pressurizing medium. I could see it if the difference was between a gas an a liquid - or there were different forms of gases, like a plasma. I'm just not buying that a tire would behave differently just because it is inflated with a different gas.

Well according to the ideal gas law and the ball example they would slightly. Any bumps encountered with a non ideal gas will have the tire rubber flex slightly more thus dissipating more energy as heat. From a link I found to a pdf today they state that most (about ~95% ) tire rolling resistance losses come from tread flex. So lessening this will reduce the losses.

I did do a quick look up and found that Nitrogen has a thermal conductivity 50% greater than Argon, which is why Argon would be used as an insulator in double paned windows - and maybe why F1 teams would use it in tires (to try to retain the heat in tires on a cold day - or conversely, to prevent the pressure build up due to brake heat).

So maybe it would help RR by retaining the heat, but I am really struggling with this being a significant factor.

From my under standing F1 race cars have no problems keeping tires warm when at race speeds (once they reach temp). In fact they have problems keeping them cool enough to avoid blistering and excessive wear. I can see adding nitrogen to keep the tires from over heating.

I wouldn't be surprised if they add a little neon to try to keep the tires cooler (as it conducts heat twice as good as air). In fact neon is lighter than air and might be a better choice than argon. Unfortunately it is far more expensive than helium or argon.

[ecomodded]

The rubber compound characteristics for heat up time & hardness vs softness is what makes the difference for all cars, the air or nitrogen/ gas used will NOT make one tire better then the other simple because its filled with it , Air is 79% nitrogen, 20% oxygen, and 1% other gases ,
a Marketing ploy by the service stations is all I see with nitrogen fill stations as all fill stations are 79% nitrogen already..

[GTR]

Everything about nitrogen in tires.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete...jsp?techid=191

Definitely seen a bit of improvement when racing. Also the storing cars long term and collectible cars etc...preventing oxidation makes sense.

I think to sum up, unless it's a race car or costs an assload of money, air is just fine.

[ecomodded]

they are charging you for that service so the pitch is moot !
why not helium ?? yuk yuk

[GTR]

Originally Posted by ecomodded

they are charging you for that service so the pitch is moot !
why not helium ?? yuk yuk

Please read the articles before commenting.

So what should drivers do?

Overall, inflating tires with nitrogen won't hurt them and may provide some minimal benefits.

Is it worth it? If you go someplace that provides free nitrogen with new tires, why not? Additionally we’ve seen some service providers offering reasonable prices of about $5 per tire (including periodic adjustments for the life of the tire) to a less reasonable $10 per tire (with additional costs for subsequent pressure adjustments) or more as part of a service contract, which we believe exceeds the value of nitrogen’s benefit.

Rather than pay extra for nitrogen, most drivers would be better off buying an accurate tire pressure gauge and checking and adjusting their tire pressures regularly.

[RedDevil]

Oh no, I'm not going to check my tire pressure at home.
I do not want to dilute the nitrogen!
Yes they are bulging a bit, but don't want to spend another 20$ on nitrogen just now...
I rather keep soldiering on and hope for the best.

Will the world end like this?

[ssnsvibe09]

in theory, a tire looses pressure due to a loss of O2 through the rubber. Apparently the rate of N2 loss compared to O2 loss is 1 to 3 or 4. So a tire initially filled with nearly ure N2 will maintain pressure longer, therefore improving safety and mileage of all of those maintenance inept drivers of the world.

Assuming that pressure loss is only attributed to permation of O2, for those of us that maintain pressure by regularly filling with normal air will eventually have purer N2 than what will be supplied by a N2 vendor which is likely just around 95%

[ecomodded]

Originally Posted by GTR

Please read the articles before commenting.

I tried honestly but after reaching this point -

Quote: While inflating tires with nitrogen never results in 100% purity, most nitrogen service equipment providers advise that reaching at least a 93% to 95% purity is necessary to receive the desired benefits.

I reached my conclusion after that bit of nonsense !

[ecomodded]

Some gases may pass heat slower or faster but constant contact with the rubber will pass the heat as fast as rubber receives it minus a few seconds for the gas heat transfer.

Its the constant heat of the rubber tire that evens out the temperature of the varied gases , minus 0 to a few seconds for heat up times is all you will see.