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Serving Tray Racing Disk ...
Hello -
I think I finally cracked the problem of my alloy wheels not being amenable to racing disk mods. Here is my normal OEM alloy wheel: http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...lloy-wheel.jpg I found this serving tray at Smart & Final for a couple of bucks : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...rving-tray.jpg It was almost perfect in size, but it needed to be trimmed, so I dremelled off the edge. This was time consuming but accurate because there was a groove in the plate for me to follow : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...ay-trimmed.jpg (the leftover circle-piece makes a great hoola-hoop for your cat, :p) I took off the center cap and removed the faux plastic lug nuts that are used to attach the center cap to the *real* lug nuts (which are double threaded for this purpose) : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...center-cap.jpg I toyed with the idea of using T-Nuts on the *inside* of the plastic lug nuts, but abandoned it (they are really intended for soft wood, not plastic) : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...42-4-t-nut.jpg I measured the diameter between the lug nut holes and found it to be 3.92". Then I hand-drilled 4 perfectly aligned holes in the serving tray (the pattern on the tray made it very easy to be accurate). Here is a picture before mounting. You can see where everything will attach : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...tray-bolts.jpg The plastic lug nuts are recessed into the alloy wheel, so I used rubber furniture feet as spacers. The center cap is gone because it's "little dome" center pushes out the serving tray. It's better to have the serving tray rest on the now-present "circular inner disk" of the alloy wheel that you see here : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...ts-spacers.jpg And here it is installed : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...-installed.jpg http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...nstalled-2.jpg Benefits : - Cheap. The disk is less than $3. The nuts and bolts do add up because I need 16 sets for all 4 wheels. But that's ok if it's robust. - 100% reversible. Only "mod" to the car is a hole in each plastic lug nut. Car is otherwise untouched. - Blackout look makes it easy to ignore brake dust and matches other black window/pillar elements in the S-Series design. I can more than live with that. It also helps to hide a valve stem hole if/when I dremel one. - Adaptable mod. You can apply this to cars with alloys or steelies. The steelies would require lug nuts that have double threads. - Disk material independent. You can use metal pizza pans if you want to. I chose the plastic serving tray because it matched the diameter of my wheel. I could even adapt *real* racing disks to attach with this method (not the ones with grabby scratchy teeth). - Serving tray is very light. I am not worried about wheel balancing or it flying off and hurting anything. - The additional nuts and bolts are symmetric, so I am not worried about wheel balancing. - I think it will be very robust (pending testing, :o). It attaches in 4 places, so I have a high level of confidence that it will not fly off. - Even my wife thinks it looks good! Problems : - The plastic serving tray is that cheap brittle plastic. It's the right shape but not the right kind of plastic. I expect that it will fail in due time. However, my main goal is to prove the mod, so I don't mind. - The rubber furniture feet are too big, so the tray is not actually touching the alloy wheel. I need to trim the feet so that the tray can be more recessed. However, I don't want the rubber feet to be *too* shallow. Otherwise, I may crack the tray. It also needs to be more flush in order to get through car washes that grab the tire and pull the car along. - No hole for valve stem. I can dremel a hole or take it off every time. Right now I am testing, so I am not in a rush to dremel the hole. Again, it's brittle plastic, so I am going to leave it be for now. - I think the better solution is to have a threaded nut *inside* the plastic lug nut. This was what the T-Nut was for. In another iteration I plan to try a K-Lock nut like this : Nuts, K-Lock nuts at Bolt Depot http://www.boltdepot.com/images/catalog/k-nut.gif This should allow for a "flusher" mount. Currently the 4 attaching bolts stick out about 1/4". (I'm going to revise the pros and cons you see above, but these are the biggies. I'm hungry so it's off to dinner ... revisions made) CarloSW2 |
Very creative installation. Looks clean, and simple. Maybe once the plastic goes try a metal or aluminum pizza pan to replace it. Gotta love the simple setup!
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best EVER!.. almost as good as caulk. lol. maybe.
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um here's an idea i just thought of for aerodynamics the other day when i was in walmart I saw it and though Caching gas saver
Duck Tape brand HD Clear tape Couldn't you cover up gaps, like the ones in your wheels or recessed light areas and use that instead of pans like this? just an idea |
Domman56 -
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http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...disk-3657.html I think clear tape would lead to "nice dark gaps" because the tape (on at least the front disk brakes) would collect the brake dust. It would be cool because it would be uniform. CarloSW2 |
Heck...why not just use some expanding foam and foam yerself an aeroshape right on the rims? Just cut out access holes fer the valve and the lug nuts and yer in business! :D
You wouldn't have to worry too much about a disk flying off and crashing into cars or about how to attach it to the rims. ;) |
Brilliant!
working the same concept. gotta seal the gap. just lost my clear shield at 56mph after 70 miles. |
Big box home improvement stores have 1" plastic snap in caps for sealing holes drilled for blown in insulation. Perhaps they would be something to try for valve stem access.
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mcrews -
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CarloSW2 |
Hello -
Quick update. So far so good, nothing wrong, solid as a rock, but 45 miles is too early to tell. What I do like is where the "blackout look" is going (thanks Christ) : (not my car, used the picture for a mock-up) http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...out-wheelz.jpg As I was saying, the window pillar trim has black accents, so the blackout look complements that. It's kind of police-car no-frills in your face look. Me likey CarloSW2 |
Hello -
I swapped out the furniture rubber feet for faucet washers. The washers are about 1/8" shorter, but that made the bolt stick out more (as seen in the Before insert) : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...et-washers.jpg Sooooo, I just added a nut to the original bolt on the *inside* of the plastic lug nuts. This shortened the bolt. This got me back to my original situation, where the bolts stick out about 3/8" from the cover : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...protrusion.jpg (You are seeing a washer with rubber backing, a lock washer, and the nut. The number of lines you see on this plate are 40 total. That is divisible by 4 and 5, so the lines can be used as guides for 4 and 5 lug wheels) I am ok with the 3/8" protrusion because I reduced my total protrusion by 1/8". Now my wheel covers are pretty much flush to the tire : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...heel-cover.jpg Here is a front view of same : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...front-view.jpg I think I can get the mounting bolts a little more flush, maybe 1/8" more. For the next wheel I think I will try a "reverse bolt" version where I put the nut *inside* the plastic lug nut. I just need to find the parts to keep the nut centered. I also need to make sure it doesn't spin around when I am attaching the bolt. Maybe all I need to do is blob some sillycone onto it. We'll see. I did just realize that the plastic tray can't be UV resistant. That implies I should paint it with a UV protective spray paint. In that case I would probably paint it white so that it doesn't suffer the sun's harmful rays. CarloSW2 |
hey there, cfg. i has a great idea. with no mention of caulk!
get rid of the lock washers. now you can make the regular nuts lock nuts by placing them on end and pounding them with a hammer to make them slightly oblong. i think that would look clean! |
That is a really nice look and a nice install. As for the nuts on the inside of the plastic lug nuts, if you have room, I think riv-nuts would be the way to go. You will have a threaded insert that will stay centered and can't spin. you can likely get the tool for under $20 and you'll find lots of other places to use it I'm sure.
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luvit -
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When it comes to washers and nuts and bolts, I have a tendency to go manic crazy. There is actually a *second* lock washer inside the plastic lug nut, sandwiched between two other washers. When I see a bolt, it's like a metal shish-kabob to me. At least it's a cheap thrill. CarloSW2 |
puddleglum -
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A riv-nut *appears* to be mounted on predominately flat panels. I would be attempting to install the riv-nut inside a small plastic cylinder. I am wandering through here right now to see if I can find what I need : Rivnut Fasteners & Bollhoff Installation Tools, Puller EZ & Custom Rivnuts - Blind Fasteners & Inserts - Bollhoff Gotta do more homework ... CarloSW2 |
This is by far the best install I've seen (sans people who can just get the snap on disks)
I've debated getting 3 more spares 15x6 and getting the snap on disks. However, I like my lightweight factory alloys. I am rather confident that I can find those double threaded lug nuts. I'll have to do some checking around. I like the idea of having the nut set into the 2nd lug nut and then using maybe a panhead phillips machine thread bolt to make it as smooth as possible. I was also thinking of drilling and tapping my stock wheel. Alot of racers do this to mount slicks (out at the edge, intentionally going into the bead of the tire). So I might be able to do it where the spoke meets the outer ring area. Drill / Tap use above mentioned bolts... 5 No 8 machine threads should be more than enough to hold on a flat plastic disc right? |
cfg83,
the tool I have looks more like a pop riveter and may be easier to use. It isn't the actual riv-nut brand and I'm sure an auto parts store would have something similar. I think that if the flange of the insert fits in the plastic nut then it should clamp in just fine. Then you could use some pan head screws on the outside. http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-pu...re1555-001.jpg |
If you have steelies you can always go to China-Mart, get yourself some $15 wheel covers and tape the holes over with high-strength gray tape. Alternatively, you can cover the wheel covers with thin vinyl sheeting. The latter approach has worked on my car for the past 10 months. It's an improvement over bare steelies. Maybe not as good as taping up the holes so it's all flush...
Here's a shot of them back when they were installed: http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...s/CIMG3434.jpg |
Carlos -
Ironically, I haven't done any of those things with my van, and I'm getting around to taking it off the road now, due to damage from it being backed into. We'll see how everything works out w/ the insurance company as to whether or not I get to do any work on it, but I guess the plan is RWD, manual trans, diesel, aero mods, and 1/2 ton suspension for now. I like the wheel covers, though. They're great, and the blackout is awesome, especially if you pay close attention to the little bit of silver that shows around the edges... it's a silver ring floating down the road! I can't think of the name of the plastic stuff that my plates were made of, but it was crap... my Father knows what it is... you couldn't even stick it in the nuker-wave, or it would literally explode into a few pieces, but I think those trays are made of a similar material, by the look. How about just using some plastic epoxy and filling the plastic nut's hex head, then drilling and threading the hardened plastic? That would allow you to use normal pan-head or machine screws, which could be put in and removed with a simple screwdriver (or dime) and would sit mostly flush. BTW - your wheel pattern is 100mm, it's metric. Looking forward to seeing how they turn out, and where it leads! |
Christ -
I was thinking of epoxying a long nut into the inside of the plastic lug nut in order to try to keep the threads "in place" : http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:6.../DSCF0047W.JPG Here are other bolts with edges that may just "lock themselves" into position : http://www.advancebolts.com/uploads/...-DSCF0051W.JPG Square Weld Nut http://www.advancebolts.com/uploads/...-DSCF2811W.JPG Spring Nut http://www.advancebolts.com/uploads/...-DSCF0054W.JPG Cage Nut Found these pictures here : Nuts Detail - Advance Bolts & Fasteners Sdn Bhd If you keep staring, the world is a giant Lego bin, :D ! CarloSW2 |
Hello -
Thar she blows! I found the plastic tray website : polarplastic.ca :: Rigid Trays This is the exact tray I got : CATERLINE - 16" Round platter Code:
Polar Code: A716PBL25 Ha ha, you can even get it in Eco-Green : http://www.polarplastic.ca/catalog/p...184-120-90.jpg But this doesn't directly help us because it's not a site that sells individual trays. It's just the origin of the tray. CarloSW2 |
ew... polystyrene.
So why not find a nut that fits inside the hex on the plastic cap snugly, and use whatever size threads that nut would have? I'm really thinking that a carriage bolt with a slot cut in the head would make a great pan screw here... |
Christ -
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I think all these ideas can solve the problem. At this point at least it's a small (3/8") problem, :) . CarloSW2 |
Oh - I remember them. I forgot they were like that on the inside. Wife's car had 'em, too.
Well, you've got 100 ideas to "fix" it, though... should be good to go, right? :P |
eco-green FTW
just need to paint a white "E"/wrench outline http://www.polarplastic.ca/catalog/p...84-600-450.jpg |
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Christ -
Heh heh heh, you never know ... stranger things have happened. CarloSW2 |
i wonder what that would look like at 50mph.
prolly just like a light green disc. |
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i see you
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and raise you an http://ecomodder.com/forum/attachmen...5&d=1263787346 |
Oh, but that's cheating! I made sure that the wrench logo was painted onto the hubcap that Carlos made in his other thread about wheel covers, where he used "Bicycler DIY" to create a somewhat convex cap, which would clear his center caps without modifying the wheel!
HA! :P Yours probably took less time, though. |
hah! :)
but yeah, 5 min job green cover, white E |
Ok, now use the actual green plate, put the white E on it, and then put it in place of the wheel cover. That will show it for sure!
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i can do this but im afraid to free-hand the E
http://ecomodder.com/forum/attachmen...p;d=1263792276 |
working on it... Gimp's taking forever.
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http://ecomodder.com/forum/attachmen...1&d=1263794409
My GIMP to you. I didn't change the opacity of the disks to show the wheels, though, because that would have just taken forever to render. Oh, and you wouldn't have noticed if I didn't say anything. |
Christ and alohaspirit -
Now that the bicycle-DIY wheel covers are no longer très chique, I have no problem Eco-E-ing them. Time to got get some green paint. CarloSW2 |
Hello -
Quick update. All four black covers are installed and working like a charm. I got the ultimate compliment a week ago. A 10 year-old kid on a skateboard told me they were cool. Therefore by extenstion I am also ":cool:" . In addition, I can tell that they attract attention on the roads because I see other drivers looking down at my tires. There is one thing I notice. It's hard to describe, but the circular edge doesn't actually touch the side of the wheel. It is being held up by the circular hole that used to be occupied by the centercap. When it's really quiet outside, I can hear the plastic tapping against the wheel. Whenever I inspect the covers they are solid. But I still have a plan for this too. I have some black door impact trim that I am going to cut into little 1/2" bits. I will install them at 3 points along the edge of the cover (because 3 points will always be "level" against the wheel). This should reduce and/or cancel the flexing. CarloSW2 |
Hello -
This is being posted for this thread : http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...cap-13471.html Here is the anatomy of my overkill but solid as a pet-rock connection system : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...tor-layout.jpg 1 - A square piece of craft sponge to keep the bolt snug. This keeps it from rattling around when I am installing the cover. The cylinder shape is from being squished up against the real lug nut. Pipe insulation is perfect in place of craft insulation. 2 - Bolt with nut screwed all the way on. This was a quick way to shorten the bolt by the width of the nut. 3 - A washer to cover the ... 4 - Lock washer to help make things snug followed by ... 5 - Another washer to cover up the lock washer. Therefore, 3+4+5 form a washer+lock washer+washer sandwich that protects the ... 6 - Plastic lug nut that is the base for the attachement system. Notice that the hole is small. I did this to preserve as much of the plastic as possible. I wanted to do this because every milligram of plastic that is preserved contributes to the robustness of the solution. That hole is 0.15" in diameter. The bolt is the same, so I have to screw it on to get it to go through. 7 - A plumbing washer that is conical in shape on the side that touches the plastic lug nut. 8 - A line representing the plastic wheel cover. 9 - A washer with a rubberized backing. In this way 7+8+9 are all "plastic on plastic" with a metal bolt going through. My thinking is that this helps to protect the (brittle plastic) wheel cover from damage by isolating it from metal parts. 10 - Another lock washer to help keep the ... 11 - Retaining nut. When I screw on the nut, even though there is nothing to keep the bolt from spinning, there is enough friction in the setup to allow the bolt to screw on quite well. I just screw it hand-tight. I have not lost a single nut (yet). Am I the son of a NASA engineer or what, ;) ? CarloSW2 |
Hello -
Here is my first system failure, a cracked disk on the front passenger wheel after about 4 months and 6000 miles : http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...nger-wheel.jpg This was predictable to me because : 1 - It's that "brittle" polystyrene plastic. 2 - It's on a mold-seam, which I already worried would crack when I was drilling holes. 3 - The question mark is to show a little piece of door-edge-guard molding I put on the wheel to make it touch the wheel. There were originally 3, but two of them flew off. It is plausible that this plastic edge piece pushed on the side of the wheel cover and contributed to the failure. The good news is I already had two more covers prepped and ready as backups. The new disk is already installed. In materials the loss is $2.50. In labor the loss is much greater, but still worth it to me because this is "hobby labor". Another good thing is that it didn't have a catastrophic failure. It cracked, I saw it, and I could fix it at my liesure. I even drove on the freeway with the crack, so I know it was not in immediate danger of flying off. I am considering sending an e-mail to the company that makes the dish and asking if they would be willing to make a batch using tougher plastic. Alternatively I could look for a restaurant supply shop and see what kind of pizza pans they offer. CarloSW2 |
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