Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > EcoModding Central
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-07-2010, 01:48 PM   #11 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
5speed5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Los Alamos, NM
Posts: 134

TBSS - '08 Chevrolet Trailblazer SS 2WD
90 day: 19.36 mpg (US)

Wife's car - '09 Chevrolet Impala SS
90 day: 22.96 mpg (US)

Big Blue Hippo - '06 Chevrolet HHR 2LT
90 day: 45.99 mpg (US)
Thanks: 8
Thanked 20 Times in 11 Posts
Just a suggestion.
If you're going to try this, maybe try it with varying mixtures of gasoline + diesel.
Start out with 25% diesel, then 50% diesel, etc.

__________________
Daily driver:
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 03-07-2010, 03:37 PM   #12 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
mechman600's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Langley, BC
Posts: 1,226

Fusion - '16 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
Thanks: 190
Thanked 272 Times in 166 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5speed5 View Post
Just a suggestion.
If you're going to try this, maybe try it with varying mixtures of gasoline + diesel.
Start out with 25% diesel, then 50% diesel, etc.
I've thought of that too. The whole entire point, really, is ultra-lean burn. With gasoline, more than 16:1 is no good for economy, but with diesel, super lean works, obviously, as there is no throttle plate. It would be interesting to see how a diesel/gasoline mixture would react to ultra-lean.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2010, 04:20 PM   #13 (permalink)
...beats walking...
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: .
Posts: 6,190
Thanks: 179
Thanked 1,522 Times in 1,123 Posts
...a LOT of people during WWII ran their cars on gasoline+kerosene (or used white-gas) due to war-time "rationing"

...my Dad told me about "wrapping" the fuel line (loosely) around the exhaust manifold to enable running on the gas+kerosene mixture AFTER the engine was fully warmed up; had to switch (valve) between two different tanks in the process: start on gas, warm-up on gas; then switch over to kerosene for driving. Of course, EPA didn't exist then!
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2010, 06:16 PM   #14 (permalink)
Smeghead
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: South Central AK
Posts: 933

escort - '99 ford escort sport
90 day: 42.38 mpg (US)

scoobaru - '02 Subaru Forester s
90 day: 28.65 mpg (US)
Thanks: 32
Thanked 146 Times in 97 Posts
mom filled her chevy astrovan with diesel once. she drove it home on the gas in the line and while it was warmed up. The next day we were able to get it to start and run very very badly. It would not drive we drained the tank and filled it with gas, after a while of cranking and barely running. We got it to run once the diesel was out of or diluted in the systems.

A jet engine running Jet A (diesel more or less) uses a spark plug to ignite the fuel charge in the hot section during starting.
__________________

Learn from the mistakes of others, that way when you mess up you can do so in new and interesting ways.

One mile of road will take you one mile, one mile of runway can take you around the world.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2010, 06:53 PM   #15 (permalink)
eco....something or other
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Colfax, WI
Posts: 716

wood hauler - '91 Ford F-250
Team Pontiac
90 day: 18.97 mpg (US)

Rav - '06 Toyota Rav4 Base
90 day: 26.52 mpg (US)
Thanks: 38
Thanked 59 Times in 45 Posts
My 1947 John Deere M can run on all three

never tried it though...
__________________



1991 F-250:
4.9L, Mazda 5 speed, 4.10 10.25" rear
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2010, 12:51 AM   #16 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
mechman600's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Langley, BC
Posts: 1,226

Fusion - '16 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
Thanks: 190
Thanked 272 Times in 166 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by IsaacCarlson View Post
My 1947 John Deere M can run on all three
never tried it though...
Nice. My dad had a 1947 John Deere G All Fuel. Gasolene, Distillate, or Kerosene. We tried it on Kerosene once, but I was too young to remember what happened....
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2010, 10:16 AM   #17 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 15
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Mechman-

Some people that know better than me or you insist that compression ratio DOES make a difference in the efficiency in the diesel cycle. See

The Diesel Engine

Even though the compression cycle is an "air spring" that regains it's energy in expansion, the expansion includes the added heat of the fuel burning... so they are not equal.

College was a long time ago, but I remember being sursprised that the diesel cycle is actually less efficient than the otto cycle also- the greater efficiencies of diesel engines come from their higher compression ratios, mainly, and secondarily from the higher heat content of the fuel.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2010, 05:58 PM   #18 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Big Dave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Steppes of Central Indiana
Posts: 1,314

The Red Baron - '00 Ford F-350 XLT
90 day: 27.99 mpg (US)

Impala Phase Zero - '96 Chevrolet Impala SS
90 day: 21.03 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 183 Times in 124 Posts
I hate to tell you this, but it has already been done. There is nothing new under the sun Ė particularly in the way of engines.

Back before the First World War, the Germans built some kerosene (the Germans called it paraffin at the time) spark ignition engines for U-boats. Prior to that all of Mr. Hollandís submarines were gasoline-powered on the surface. Given the volatility of gasoline, early subs were unmitigated fire hazards which gave a lot of scope for reports of ďÖlost with all hands.Ē Kerosene and diesel (No. 1 and No. 2 middle distillate) have a much lower vapor pressure and as described are much less of a fire hazard. These engines did work, after a fashion. They ran and didnít blow up (like gasoline subs) and in fact one paraffin-engine U-boat (the U-9) was quite successful.

The paraffin engines were nowhere near as powerful as either gasoline of diesel engines of the same size. The flame-front of kerosene is nowhere near as fast as that of a mixture of air and gasoline vapor. The paraffin boats were slow on the surface. The famous U-9 (and all paraffin boats) also had another characteristic they had to overcome: The paraffin engine smoked like a coal-fired battlecruiser. The plume could be seen for miles. She could only run of the surface at night or in an area where she could not be spotted.

But paraffin was abandoned when capable diesels came along (read after the invention of Herr Boschís fuel injector). The paraffin boats finished the war as training boats.

Iím not entirely sure what mechman600 is driving at. If he has a source of cheap kerosene, use it in a diesel instead. Diesels run just fine on kerosene. Iíve done it myself. If you have straight mechanical injection put a dollop of motor oil in the kerosene to reduce wear on the injector pump.

You might get that bike to run, but it will run poorly and smoke like a steam locomotive.
__________________
2000 Ford F-350 SC 4x2 6 Speed Manual
4" Slam
3.08:1 gears and Gear Vendor Overdrive
Rubber Conveyor Belt Air Dam
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2010, 11:17 PM   #19 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
5speed5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Los Alamos, NM
Posts: 134

TBSS - '08 Chevrolet Trailblazer SS 2WD
90 day: 19.36 mpg (US)

Wife's car - '09 Chevrolet Impala SS
90 day: 22.96 mpg (US)

Big Blue Hippo - '06 Chevrolet HHR 2LT
90 day: 45.99 mpg (US)
Thanks: 8
Thanked 20 Times in 11 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimG View Post
Mechman-

the greater efficiencies of diesel engines come from their higher compression ratios, mainly, and secondarily from the higher heat content of the fuel.
Also, from the lack of a throttle in the air intake.
__________________
Daily driver:
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2010, 04:16 AM   #20 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
mechman600's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Langley, BC
Posts: 1,226

Fusion - '16 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
Thanks: 190
Thanked 272 Times in 166 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Dave View Post
Iím not entirely sure what mechman600 is driving at. If he has a source of cheap kerosene....
....You might get that bike to run, but it will run poorly and smoke like a steam locomotive.
You seem to see right through me! I have access to free diesel fuel. Like I said, I give this whole idea a 5% chance. If it doesn't work, at least I had fun trying. If it does, I'll be laughing my ass off.

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Tags
autoignite, convert, diesel, pumping losses

Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Electric car conversion: Project ForkenSwift MetroMPG Fossil Fuel Free 1041 07-28-2014 09:19 AM
EcoModding for Beginners: Getting great gas mileage. SVOboy EcoModding Central 55 08-20-2012 11:34 PM
Hyper Alert: Engine Damage (ring/cyl wear killing ignition to running carb'd engine) gjgerhard Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed 33 02-08-2011 08:03 PM
Diesel engine braking puzzle Crazyrabbit EcoModding Central 20 03-11-2010 09:43 PM
10 years to build an electric car? - Blog article bennelson Fossil Fuel Free 8 01-26-2009 09:01 AM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com