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-   -   Warm air intake? how about warm fuel? (https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/warm-air-intake-how-about-warm-fuel-2295.html)

ebacherville 05-12-2008 03:18 PM

Warm air intake? how about warm fuel?
 
the idea behind warm air intake is the fuel atomizes better, any one thought about warming fuel before its used by the motor?

This is how vegetable oil conversions thin the oil out for injection so it atomizes better.. they run the oil through heat exchangers that warm the veggie oil up to coolant temp..

Any thought or any one try it?

SVOboy 05-12-2008 03:21 PM

I don't really buy the atomization bit for warm air intake. The real reason it works on some cars is because the ECU leans out the fuel mix to compensate for the lower oxygen content in the hot air.

That said, there've been a lot of "hot fuel mods" out there but I've never been convinced by one.

Duffman 05-12-2008 03:23 PM

I think there is depending on the circumstances. Diesel absolutely, gasoline in cold weather possibly, but gains would be less than diesel. I want to heat the fuel lines with electricity, does anybody have an idea of a product that works off 12V that I can wrap around a fuel line. I do not want to just wrap wire around my lines.

Daox 05-12-2008 03:27 PM

The Matrix/Corolla/Vibe/Celica (1ZZ engine) fuel rail is tucked in close to the engine with insulation around it. This is the first production fuel injected engine I've seen heat fuel. But, I'd have to say it'll work on some engine and not on others. Any engines designed close to the knock limit may not like warm fuel. So, its going to be one of those hit or miss things.

Check out post #27 here for pictures: http://forum.ecomodder.com/showthrea...5.html?p=22861

ebacherville 05-12-2008 03:37 PM

If your going to heat the fuel why use electric? causes more electrical load on your car, use that waste heat the motor makes so well, do a coolant exchanger.. can be as simple as a copper or aluminum pipe with-in a larger rubber heater hose. Thats how us Veggie Oil burners do it usually, or you can by small flat plate heat exchangers to do the same thing.

The ICE wastes so much energy as heat its ridiculous.. use it..

One other i though i has was a peltiere cooler type of device, there make ones that generate power from heat sources too, a big aray could replace your alternator.. no load , and recapturing that waste heat.

Duffman 05-12-2008 03:45 PM

Ebacherville,
Thanks for the suggestion but not going to happen at least right now while inder warranty. I want to do this on a diesel and I regularly see -15C start ups in the winter and I want something more instantaineous and diesels do not have an abundance of waste heat in the cold either. Also increased load is the best way to warm up a diesel in the cold so it is not as bad it seems.

cfg83 05-12-2008 03:46 PM

ebacherville -

I think this works, but you need to design a system that has discreet control over the fuel temp, especially in gassers. If the gasoline gets too hot, you can experience vapor lock (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vapour_lock). The "no cost" way to heat the fuel is to use the coolant hose as a heater, but that means you lose the discreet control I was talking about.

Here is one (for diesels) that uses engine coolant :

IN-LINE FUEL WARMERS
http://www.arctic-fox.com/sitepages/pid43.php
http://www.arctic-fox.com/images/products/inlines.jpg

Here is another electric powered one for diesels that I would be terrified to use on gassers :

HotlineŽ Electric In-Line Fuel Heater
http://www.arctic-fox.com/sitepages/pid20.php
http://www.arctic-fox.com/images/img/hot.jpg

CarloSW2

Duffman 05-12-2008 03:52 PM

Thats exactly what I wanted, thanks Carlos
Hope the price is reasonable.

Edit: Sorry its close to what I want, I am looking for something to wrap around steel lines, I dont want to do intrusive mods right now.

diesel_john 05-12-2008 03:58 PM

the fuel really can't get to the engine without getting warmed in a diesel or a gas. With gas engines warm fuel is actually a problem because it recirculated back to the tank causing higher vapor pressures in the tank. gasoline can slowly escape from the tank unless everything is perfect, thereby actually decreasing your fuel mileage before it ever gets to your fuel meter. this is not as much a problem for the diesel which can sit in an open bucket for month. with gasoline there is fuel lost before it ever gets to your car also. i would hate to think how much gasoline is lost before it gets to the engine.

there is web site in England i think where a gentleman does test all these types of ideas and product gimmicks. I did ask him specificly about this very question and he assured me it would not help for gas engines and went through all reasons why. you should be able to find a thread on this site about it. now if your an ice road trucker obviously your out there. out there.

ebacherville 05-12-2008 04:06 PM

if your looking for a electric solution to wrap around steel lines, the veggie world uses stainless steeel welder wire, there are people in the veggie world that sell them there usualy called "injection line heaters" there just a certain length of stainless steel wire feed welder wire that makes a certain AMP load then there insulated in special high temp heat insulation and wrapped around the injection lines on the diesel engine. There usually cheap.. under $50 for 4 or 5 of them.. you can make them your self even cheaper.

As for vapor lock, The engine coolant hopefully would be cool enough to not lock it, you could use a automatic valve that coupled to a temp sensor to regulat the temps.


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