Go Back   EcoModder Forum > Off-Topic > The Lounge
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-08-2018, 04:15 AM   #21 (permalink)
Ecomuggler
 
Xist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 6,906

Chorizo - '00 Honda Civic HX, baby! :D
90 day: 34.82 mpg (US)

Mid-Life Crisis Fighter - '99 Honda Accord LX
90 day: 35.06 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,039
Thanked 1,320 Times in 991 Posts
It's life Jim, but not we know it.

  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 06-08-2018, 05:17 PM   #22 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
aerohead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sanger,Texas,U.S.A.
Posts: 9,158
Thanks: 12,755
Thanked 4,822 Times in 2,760 Posts
CO2 and growth

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xist View Post
While we have discussed atmospheric CO2 levels in a ridiculously long thread immediately abandoned by its creator, somehow I did not realize that CO2 is measured by parts per million, not percentage.
I read elsewhere that too much carbon dioxide makes water acidic and plants may not create oxygen fast enough for their own needs. I also read that more CO2 will help plants grow, but without increasing other nutrients, they will be deficient.
This page states "Ambient levels of CO2 hover around 400-500 ppm. When you increase that level to around 1,000-1,500 ppm, you will see an increase in your yields and your plants will be much healthier." https://www.maximumyield.com/what-ar...ying-it/7/2610

Is this science fair material?
I'll make a stab :
CO2 is considered fertilizer to plants.
Increased CO2 will increase crop yields,however CO2 does not discriminate between plants,and while crops grow,so do weeds.And more herbicides($) may be required per acre to control unwanted weeds,and the increased chemicals may exceed established thresholds for exposure.
Temperature is another animal.
Rice yield declines from higher night time temps.
El Salvador has lost 90% of its coffee crop due to elevated temps,along with 2,500 dead cane cutters over the last two decades,who experienced renal failure on the job,unable to remain hydrated in the increased heat.
In 2002 Canada saw a 5% drop in their wheat harvest due to temps.
In 2003 record heat in Europe cut production 90-million tonnes,and killed 52,000 people,in 9-countries.
In 2005 the U.S.Corn Belt saw a shortfall of 34-million tons.
In 2010 Russia lost 40% of it's wheat,leading to banned exports,food prices soared, which sparked the Arab Spring.56,000 people died in the heat wave,smog,and wildfires.
Pine beetle northern migration meant tree kills leading to lightning-triggered wildfires in the U.S..
__________________
Photobucket album: http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj622/aerohead2/
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2018, 05:27 PM   #23 (permalink)
Ecomuggler
 
Xist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 6,906

Chorizo - '00 Honda Civic HX, baby! :D
90 day: 34.82 mpg (US)

Mid-Life Crisis Fighter - '99 Honda Accord LX
90 day: 35.06 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,039
Thanked 1,320 Times in 991 Posts
Dr. Kei Mori filtered out ultraviolet and infrared light. He was confounding variables, but Aerohead, it seems like that would benefit everyone you mentioned, although I cannot imagine how it would be executed outside of a greenhouse.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2018, 01:44 PM   #24 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
aerohead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sanger,Texas,U.S.A.
Posts: 9,158
Thanks: 12,755
Thanked 4,822 Times in 2,760 Posts
a smattering of CO2 /plant data

In a November,2015 National Geographic,pp.90-92,'Crop Changes',from,International Food Policy Research Institute and UN Food and Agricultural Org.:
*Climate change is likely to be most forgiving of wheat,but not enough to offset losses from other major crops.
*Midwestern US 20% drop in corn production.
*More pests for mid-elevation potato-growing areas.
*Brazilian farmers will see a 16% decline.
*N.European potato farmers see longer growing season,while farther south will become increasingly dry.
*New areas will open up for corn,but yields will decline in existing areas.
*It may be possible to grow potatoes farther north or higher in mountains.
*Rice may do well.
*Virtually all climate scenarios show reduced wheat yields,more devastating crop diseases.
*West Africa may support more rice.
*Indonesia's rice will be largely spared,but corn will decline as much as 20%.
*New parts of Australia will become arable,but droughts will require efficient farming if growing wheat is to continue.
*Yields of crops like soybeans could increase,but soybean and barley nutritive content may be less.
__________________
Photobucket album: http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj622/aerohead2/
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2018, 03:03 PM   #25 (permalink)
...beats walking...
 
Old Tele man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 6,222
Thanks: 179
Thanked 1,516 Times in 1,119 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by aerohead View Post
I'll make a stab :
CO2 is considered fertilizer to plants.
Increased CO2 will increase crop yields,however CO2 does not discriminate between plants,and while crops grow,so do weeds.And more herbicides($) may be required per acre to control unwanted weeds,and the increased chemicals may exceed established thresholds for exposure.
Temperature is another animal.
Rice yield declines from higher night time temps.
El Salvador has lost 90% of its coffee crop due to elevated temps,along with 2,500 dead cane cutters over the last two decades,who experienced renal failure on the job,unable to remain hydrated in the increased heat.
In 2002 Canada saw a 5% drop in their wheat harvest due to temps.
In 2003 record heat in Europe cut production 90-million tonnes,and killed 52,000 people,in 9-countries.
In 2005 the U.S.Corn Belt saw a shortfall of 34-million tons.
In 2010 Russia lost 40% of it's wheat,leading to banned exports,food prices soared, which sparked the Arab Spring.56,000 people died in the heat wave,smog,and wildfires.
Pine beetle northern migration meant tree kills leading to lightning-triggered wildfires in the U.S..
The University of Arizona scientists at Bio Sphere 2 claim 800 ppm CO2 is the limit above which rain-forest plant growth ceases and death/decay begins to accelerate.
__________________
2014 Toyota Prius 1.8L eCVT
2009 Pontiac Vibe 1.8L/SFI 4A
2004 Pontiac Vibe 1.8L/MFI 4A

2011 Chevrolet LTZ Cruze 1.4LT 6A
1971 Dodge Charger 318 3A
1970 Plymouth AAR 'Cuda 340/6BBL 4M
1968 Dodge Charger 383 3A
1967 Plymouth Barracuda Formula S 383 4M
1965 Plymouth Barracuda Formula S 273 4M
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Old Tele man For This Useful Post:
aerohead (06-09-2018), Xist (06-09-2018)
Old 06-13-2018, 03:22 PM   #26 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
aerohead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sanger,Texas,U.S.A.
Posts: 9,158
Thanks: 12,755
Thanked 4,822 Times in 2,760 Posts
some extra data

From: 'Will Plants Profit From High CO2?',by Elizabeth Culotta,Science,VOL.268.5 May 1995,pp.654-6
*CO2 is an aerial fertilizer
*in experimental,single-variable,CO2 enrichment,the higher concentration 'may' help many crops grow faster,increase yields.
*in 'natural ecosystems',the effects are less clear.
*hundreds of questions about what happens to the rest of the forest,soil microbes to poison ivy.
*CO2 can affect virtually every aspect of the structure and function of terrestrial ecosystems-from flowering times to microbial activity,species diversity.
*not all plants react the same way:with either a C3 or C4 carbon pathway.
*without added water,light,pest control,fertilizer,CO2 doesn't necessarily help plant growth.
*CO2's affect on insects,weeds,livestock unpredictable.
*High CO2 can mean low nitrogen leaf area,less protein for livestock
*High CO2 doesn't guarantee good biodiversity.
*Plants in natural ecosystems don't always respond to high CO2 the way crops do.
*Photosynthesis levels off over time.
*tundra returns to pre-CO2 level growth after 6-weeks.
*trees level off after 6-weeks
*during wet years prairie grass grows no better.
*in the past 100-years up to 10% of increased crop yields have come from higher CO2 rather than new crop varieties,fertilizers and insecticides.
*CO2 long term,less nitrogen in leaf litter = less available nitrogen to plant
*estimated global response to a 2X increase in CO2 = 10-20% growth increase.
*Plants will not be able to balance the carbon budget.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Also,
from:'A Clearer View of Why Plants Make Haze,' by Christine Mlot,plant biologist,Science,VOL.268,5 May 1995,pp.641-42.
*Heat increases the production of bio-hydrocarbon VOCs,mostly Isoprene,which when combined with BBQ/tailpipe emissions of Nitrogen Oxides,create ground level ozone (NOx) in the presence of sunlight,which destroy pulmonary tissue for those breathing it, and create nitric acid vapor at the water's surface of lakes.
*The warmer it gets,the more plants produce it,as they attempt to protect their host chlorophyll,which without isoprene gives out at 37-degrees C.
__________________
Photobucket album: http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj622/aerohead2/

Last edited by aerohead; 06-13-2018 at 05:24 PM.. Reason: spell
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2018, 03:53 PM   #27 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 4,496

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 28.24 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 79.06 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 29.67 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,680
Thanked 1,467 Times in 1,025 Posts
Crop yields have trended upwards for years over the decades, but that's a poor indicator of the impact of CO2. However, it's probably a good indicator of the ingenuity of humans, so whatever happens, we're likely to adapt well to the changes, and I forsee improving standards of living for the world at least through the next hundred years.

The oceans rose about 8" along with temperature and CO2 during this timeframe, similar to what is projected for the next 100 years.

__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (06-13-2018)
Old 06-13-2018, 04:20 PM   #28 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
freebeard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 11,511
Thanks: 2,647
Thanked 3,716 Times in 2,945 Posts
Quote:
*CO2 can effect virtually every aspect of the structure and function of terrestrial ecosystems-from flowering times to microbial activity,species diversity.
effect ≠ affect.

__________________
.
The generation of random numbers is too important to be left to chance.
_________________
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to freebeard For This Useful Post:
aerohead (06-13-2018), jamesqf (06-14-2018)
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com