Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Aerodynamics
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-11-2017, 02:37 PM   #61 (permalink)
Permanent Lurker
 
seifrob's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Czechoslovakia (sort of), Europe
Posts: 240

Dáčenka - '10 Dacia / Renault Logan MCV 1.5 dCi (X90 k9k)
90 day: 42.53 mpg (US)
Thanks: 81
Thanked 145 Times in 54 Posts
Sounds kinda defeated to me. I know nothing about how your bussiness is going, but as I see it, you are miles ahead of all of them.

1) there is no proof Nikola Motors is not second Elio. I still think their truck is more vaporware than real product.
2) Mr. Musk is looking way too much to the future. having autonomous electric personal transport is one thing, having electric multi ton rig with potentionally hazardous cargo driving on its own is completely different story. Never mind 300 miles range they offer.
3) You do not need completely new infrastructure. There are plenty of gas stations right now. Your truck can go anywhere where regular trucks go nowadays. Send any electric truck to northern territory and watch the show. 4) even the E.U starts to admit that electric future is not as bright as they hoped and we simply are not ready for massive electrification. Diesel will stay at least few decades.
5) For conservative investor, improving already proven technology is the way to go, and its you who did it.
Your solution makes perfect sense, you have experience, you have manufacturing capacity, you use off the shelf parts and proven chassis and axles from big rig manufacturer (do you still ??), so your customers could service their StarShips anywhere they want.

Do not give up. All you need is few more engine options, hybrid and ICE only version so your customers can choose, and better marketing.
(To be honest, what Nikola motors did was masterpiece of marketing and I was so sorry they made it sooner than you did.)


Last edited by seifrob; 11-11-2017 at 04:18 PM.. Reason: fixed typos, added clarification
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to seifrob For This Useful Post:
Xist (11-11-2017)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 11-11-2017, 02:55 PM   #62 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
freebeard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 8,793
Thanks: 1,909
Thanked 2,876 Times in 2,245 Posts
Quote:
But I have other cool projects in mind after we run the StarShip all around the country in 2018.
Looking forward to what they might be.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2017, 06:20 PM   #63 (permalink)
home of the odd vehicles
 
rmay635703's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere in WI
Posts: 2,628

Silver - '10 Chevy Cobalt XFE
Thanks: 219
Thanked 413 Times in 312 Posts
I think you overestimate the effects of autonomous and ev semis on the market.

They will only penetrate a niche in a very small area of the country.

20 years from now, who knows but in the next 10 years I expect less to change than you think.
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to rmay635703 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (11-18-2017), Joggernot (11-11-2017)
Old 11-12-2017, 02:54 AM   #64 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
freebeard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 8,793
Thanks: 1,909
Thanked 2,876 Times in 2,245 Posts
You may be right, but cars replaced horses on the streets of New York City in 10 years. ...and people weren't in such a hurry then.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2017, 04:25 AM   #65 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: idaho
Posts: 207
Thanks: 0
Thanked 65 Times in 49 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebeard View Post
You may be right, but cars replaced horses on the streets of New York City in 10 years. ...and people weren't in such a hurry then.
It was a really easy choice. Horses were far worse polluters than cars. URBAN POLLUTION-Many long years ago - CARRIAGE HORSE History - Coalition for New York City Animals

Edit: Note the original source of the article. Not written by one of the nutters who wants to ban carriages in New York City.

Last edited by Galane; 11-13-2017 at 02:22 AM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2017, 06:07 PM   #66 (permalink)
home of the odd vehicles
 
rmay635703's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere in WI
Posts: 2,628

Silver - '10 Chevy Cobalt XFE
Thanks: 219
Thanked 413 Times in 312 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebeard View Post
You may be right, but cars replaced horses on the streets of New York City in 10 years. ...and people weren't in such a hurry then.
Every EV semi like vehicle on the road today travels less than 10 miles from its base.

Every offering more or less appeals to companies moving around “stuff” on campus or between a production point and a depo or shipper.

Many ev semis move trailers around a yard.

OTR EV semis like the ones that drive coast to coast are very unlikely and won’t have volume for decades if at all.

This is why I don’t think the starship and an EV semi are really in any sort of competition

I think the Starships competition is the fact that many OTR operators don’t care as much about fuel use due to its lowish price.

Indeed, many operators will sacrifice economy for speed and payload due to labor cost.

Autonomous is irrelevant for many years, more and more makers are finding “auto” self driving vehicles belong in a closed area and really need infrastructure changes to be less painful
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to rmay635703 For This Useful Post:
slowmover (11-18-2017)
Old 11-17-2017, 10:31 AM   #67 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
JRMichler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Phillips, WI
Posts: 928

Nameless - '06 GMC Canyon
90 day: 36.73 mpg (US)
Thanks: 178
Thanked 352 Times in 227 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shepherd777 View Post
The Cummins X15 engine in the new truck will operate at 850 RPM at normal highway cruise speed, for most of the day. Redline is only 1100 RPM.
Can you tell us more about this engine? Cummins advertises a 2000 RPM redline. Is this a special engine? Or are you just running a stock engine at low RPM? Why not an X12 engine, which is almost 1000 lbs lighter?
__________________
The vacuum gauge plus wheel covers helped increase summer 2015 mileage to 38.5 MPG, while summer 2016 mileage was 38.6 MPG without the wheel covers. Drove 10,588.6 miles in 2016 at 35.0 MPG.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2017, 11:35 AM   #68 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
JockoT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Scotland
Posts: 654

All That Jazz - '06 Honda Jazz i-DSI S
Team Honda
90 day: 48.72 mpg (US)
Thanks: 36
Thanked 120 Times in 90 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shepherd777 View Post
When I initially started this project in 2014, I had envisioned my company becoming a niche OEM, building 5, 10, 25, or maybe 50 hyper fuel mileage Class 8 trucks per year for various enlightened customers.

The heavy duty truck industry has completely changed since then.

There is now Tesla, Nikola, platooning, autonomous vehicles, Amazon, and billions of dollars of venture capital have arrived. Smart people have figured out what was obvious to me for almost four decades. That big trucks get so poor fuel mileage and run so many miles, one can save a ton of dough by doing things differently.

So this will be the last truck that I build. But I have other cool projects in mind after we run the StarShip all around the country in 2018.
Tesla appears to have moved the goalposts.
__________________
People Think They Are Thinking When They Are Merely Rearranging Their Prejudices


  Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2017, 01:59 PM   #69 (permalink)
Grand Imperial Poobah
 
Shepherd777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Newington, CT USA
Posts: 231
Thanks: 28
Thanked 439 Times in 131 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMichler View Post
Can you tell us more about this engine? Cummins advertises a 2000 RPM redline. Is this a special engine? Or are you just running a stock engine at low RPM? Why not an X12 engine, which is almost 1000 lbs lighter?
All modern Cummins truck engines are rated for 1800 RPM redline. Years ago they used to be 2100 RPM.

The 15L X15 Cummins that I have in the new truck is from an initial run of prototype engines, but the specs have not changed much, if at all, from the production engines. So basically, yes, we are running a stock engine at lower RPMs.

The X15 makes slightly over 200 HP at idle. So why would one have to run it at much RPMs if the vehicle that envelopes it only needs double-digit horsepower at cruise speed? The X15 makes peak torque at 1000 RPM and slightly below. It will make a lot more horsepower at 1800 RPM, 400 HP to be exact in this configuration. But when climbing a grade I'm not interested in horsepower to a degree, I'm really only interested in torque.

X12 production is not set to begin until next year. I may try one then in the StarShip. The reasoning for the current 15 liter X15 is a unique operational technique that I call "inertia displacement." When chugging along at ultra-low RPM, the inertia of the big block Cummins displacement will enable it to just keep pulling and making torque, vs. a 13, 12, or even an 11 liter engine.

Like the old saying goes, "there's no replacement for displacement."
__________________
Bob Sliwa
"Like a Midget at a Urinal, I knew I was gonna have to stay on my toes......."

http://www.airflowtruck.com
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Shepherd777 For This Useful Post:
BamZipPow (11-18-2017), freebeard (11-17-2017)
Old 11-17-2017, 02:00 PM   #70 (permalink)
Grand Imperial Poobah
 
Shepherd777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Newington, CT USA
Posts: 231
Thanks: 28
Thanked 439 Times in 131 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JockoT View Post
Tesla appears to have moved the goalposts.
Actually, all of the Venture Capitalists and all of the other money dudes have moved the goalposts.

__________________
Bob Sliwa
"Like a Midget at a Urinal, I knew I was gonna have to stay on my toes......."

http://www.airflowtruck.com
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com