Building a car from scratch- how would YOU do it?

[rykoala]

So lets say you were going to build a car from scratch and design it from the get-go to get the best mileage possible. The only restriction that I would put on it is that it has to be a full ICE drivetrain- no hybrids, no electrics. Two occupants (driver/passenger) and enough cargo space to have room for a weeks worth of groceries for 2 people.

So, how would you do it?

I personally would build a rear wheel drive with a fwd engine/transaxle in the rear, with the occupants side by side in front of it, and low to the ground, and very low profile. You'd have to step down into it. It would be no taller than required for reasonable comfort and enough height to accommodate the engine and radiator. It would also be just wide enough to handle the tires, with the rears enclosed in wheel skirts, and the fronts fendered but open like on most cars. The engine would be a 3 or 4cyl low displacement engine (1.0l would be more than enough) and the transmission a manual. Tires would be the narrowest I could find, and the body would be fiberglass.

But, I know little about car design. How would you do it?

(bored)

[cfg83]

rykoala -

I'd just build this :

Perry Ds 550 Spyder
http://www.kitcarmag.com/featuredveh...ica/index.html


I like it because it uses a STOCK VW chassis. The only problem from my POV is cleaning up it's emissions. I am sure you could find a replacement engine if you went on a quest and/or deactivated two of it's cylinders. Hrrmmmmm, maybe an OBDII compliannt Porsche Boxer engine with cylinder deactivation?!?!?!?!?

Put your groceries here :

http://www.kitcarmag.com/featuredveh.../photo_06.html

The package tray behind the seats and just forward of the engine bay offers plenty of room for a long weekend's worth of luggage.

The Perry Ds, Inc. 550 Spyder

Here's the main website :

www.perryspyder.com

CarloSW2

[whokilledthejams]

Old VW front beam (for simplicity), and the rear half of a motorcycle-- a reverse trike. Small, seats two, handles like it's on rails, and still reasonably efficient, without the terror of an actual motorcycle. A teardrop-shaped body for minimum drag would be relatively easy, without being overly-long.

[Johnny Mullet]

Didn't Homer Simpson do this and fail?

[1GCRXHF]

Go with a small diesel motor, maybe an old VW. Then gear it way long, I would take super low revving diesel over a motorcycle type setup anyday, especially if I'm building it from scratch anyway.

[MetroMPG]

I think I'd go with a tandem layout (either 4 wheel or 3), like the VW 1L, or the Jet car 2.5.

[ttoyoda]

rykoala
You are describing this:
http://www.arielatom.com/
With a low power engine and more bodywork.

[whokilledthejams]

Originally Posted by Johnny Mullet

Didn't Homer Simpson do this and fail?

Spectacularly, if I recall.

Originally Posted by ttoyoda

rykoala
You are describing this:
http://www.arielatom.com/
With a low power engine and more bodywork.

You know, I'd bet an Atom is already halfway efficient, considering it performs on par with a lot of supercars. Taller gearing and a less aggressively-tuned engine (it comes with a Chevy in the US, and a Honda in Europe, I believe).

See also: Caterham Se7en:
http://www.uscaterham.com/home.html

[whokilledthejams]

Originally Posted by Frank Lee

I'd go trike for ease of passing a license inspection. And other reasons.

That's my reasoning, too. A reverse trike is even better, for handling and stability. Hence, my junkyard version of the VW GX3 and Peugeot 20CUP.

[dcb]

Originally Posted by whokilledthejams

without the terror of an actual motorcycle

I am having a difficult time with this statement. Most folks who ride motorcycles enjoy them immensely, and enjoy good performance/economy and handling to boot. Add a little trailer and carry all the groceries you want.

You shouldn't rule out the obvious winners due to preconceptions

Maybe one of these diesel jobs :




or wrap a 600-klt like this:

[ebacherville]

id do a tadpole (reverse) trike, havds down the most stable and easiest to build..

I have actually been debating doing this for a long time .. the addition of a diesel engine could really make it shine.. however its going to take some fab work,

The motorcycle with a front passanger are is farly simple to construct, easy to get road worthy as its considered a motorcycle.. hardly any regulations.. and the skape is a natural for a ideal tear drop shaped craft...

My version would probably consist of a 125 -250 cc scooter drive line, for the ultimate in MPG's.. 250 cc scooters get great MPG and do freeway speeds.. even a 125 will do 60mph pretty effortlessly..

However a water cooled motor is preferred, use the radiator as cabin heat in the winter.. in the summer just vent to the outdoors.

[dremd]

Pure electric 550 Spyder.

[cfg83]

whokilledthejams -

Originally Posted by whokilledthejams

...

You know, I'd bet an Atom is already halfway efficient, considering it performs on par with a lot of supercars. Taller gearing and a less aggressively-tuned engine (it comes with a Chevy in the US, and a Honda in Europe, I believe).

See also: Caterham Se7en:
http://www.uscaterham.com/home.html

The Atom weighs 1400 lbs with a 245 HP Honda K20 engine. It looks like the K20 weighs in at around 350 lbs.

A 2nd Gen Honda CRX HX engine, D15B6, weighs in at .... can't find it, . Let's assume 50 lbs less than the K20 for the purpose of comparison. The HF is 62 HP. It weighs 1967 lbs. From this we can compare power/weight ratios :

2nd Gen CRX HF : 1967 lbs / 62 HP = 31.72 lbs / HP
Atom + HF engine : (1400 - 50) / 62 = 21.77 lbs / HP

The Atom+HF is better than a CRX DX :

2nd Gen CRX DX : 2102 lbs / 89 HP = 23.61 lbs / HP

This implies (to me) That an Atom+HF would get the MPG of an HF with the zoom of a DX. Coolio, .

CarloSW2

[rykoala]

I love the trike ideas! The VW front with a low power pusher motor in the back makes really good sense. I really want to build something for a car. I just go done building my own recumbent bicycle and have 3 more to build (the whole family wants one!) but I have wanted to build my own car from scratch ever since I was a kid. Maybe next year I'll start it, and will be able to start gathering parts over the winter.

So any other ideas?

[cfg83]

dremd -

Originally Posted by dremd

Pure electric 550 Spyder.

Ask and you shall receive :

Electric 550 Spyder
http://www.ohler.com/ev/spyder/

Once running the track time sheet will be added to the page. I'm shooting for 0 to 60 mph in under 5 seconds. The car weighs 2600 pounds and the weight ratio, front to rear is 44/56. The motor develops over 300 horsepower.

CarloSW2

[Duffman]

Originally Posted by Frank Lee

I'd go trike for ease of passing a license inspection. And other reasons.

I know every state/province is different, but as long as you start with a roadworthy VIN, I think you could cut and paste a firewall/dash onto any project you wanted.

[rykoala]

Originally Posted by dremd

Pure electric 550 Spyder.

Originally Posted by rykoala

The only restriction that I would put on it is that it has to be a full ICE drivetrain- no hybrids, no electrics.

[Duffman]

I think it would be highly possible to build a 40+mpg 32 Ford Coupe using reproduction Fibreglass bodies. Small nose, an engine bay that you could do anything you wanted, and the cool factor is a 10 out 10.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1243/...d73a8e.jpg?v=0
http://www.members.streetrodcentral..../roberts32.jpg

[rykoala]

While searching for 2 cylinder VW engines, I ran across this. I'm sure y'all have seen it, but I think its very cool. Too technologically complex IMHO, but 317mpg is nothing to laugh at!
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/gw/vw1litre.htm

[Vince-HX]

linkpin vw front beam for low maintenance and ninja 250 engine and swingarm.

Kawasaki just released the "updated" version of the Ninja 250 this year so older models go for way cheap. The engine is very simple and makes 36hp and 17 lbs plus it has a 14,000 redline

I have a 2005 Ninja 250 that I ride the crap out of and the worst mileage I ever got was 45 mpg, and i'm talking about practically redlining it in every gear, lol. SuperSuperfun bike though, and i'm a 200 lbs guy


In a chassis with better aerodynamics (motorcycles are horrible) I would think 100+ mpg is possible with a few mods like a sprag clutch. That would allow you to Pulse and Glide super easy because the trike would freewheel anytime you got off the throttle.

This is exactly what I plan to start building in the next month. I was able to score a complete low mile 1995 250 for $200 and I have a few front beams to choose from in my backyard. Should take only about a month and less then a total of $1000 to complete.

Sure a scooter engine would work but 14,000 rpms of 250cc fury sound AMAZING