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Old 03-20-2013, 05:32 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Efficient Shipping

Reading through this thread:
Wal-Mart Aero Mods

Whilst started back in 2009, and other random topics of trains and train/trailer hualing added-in the mix.
I got a random idea more centralized and more "Local" if you will modes or alternative type of vehicles to use for transportaion of certain goods...

Take for example a
School bus, now this obviously was built for pure passenger transport. Maybe not the greatest of accomidations, but it gets the job done.
To note, I still have not yet heard, seen or smelled one running off recycled cooking oils...

This baffles me, when we already have
City buses, that run off of recycled cooking oils. That kind of smelly smell of french fries and fish is unmistakable. Now, this Brick body type is made for special accomidations such as Rider comfort, option to sit/stand and also for handicapped/disabled individuals = low platform...

But aren't "school buses" just as capable? IF not, they can be, very easily, and cheaply at that.
Which brings the thought. Why are school buses not shaped the same way as City buses or vise-versa? More-so, whay are school buses so difficult to get in-out, in the first place? Wouldn't it make more sense to make them more similar to a city bus platform but with the continued objective of max passenger count...
(I'm certainly aware that more lower "Brick" looking school buses are being made)

Has anyone ever noticed that city buses regardless of seat capacity along some routes NEVER have even half the amount of occupants inside them at any given time?!
I mean, a 40+ occupancy, only always has like 2-5ppl along a given route.

I've also even talked to a bus company about what type of engines they have in service. Have gathered that the diesel' in the large buses are the SAME exact model as the smaller passenger buses based on my information... Why would a smaller bus need more power for its given load?!

Also, the Estimations of fuel economy are very ranged as well.
I believe nation estimations were
City Wide Buses get anywhere from 4-6mpg, avg. 10.5mph(other source)
Tour Buses get between 9-11mpg, avg. 55mph(random guess)
School Bus gets 7-12mpg, avg. 17mph(other source)
Semi Trucks(loaded) are anywhere 4-7mpg, avg. 55mph(random guess)

Now what im really getting into, is that:
Wouldn't one think that utilizing a Small transport Van/bus for known low demand bus routes, School buses for a City bus needs, using a City bus (engine under floor layout), as a "Fixed" Cargo Box truck, or even for Smallish OTR regional shipments. I mean hell, its basically a shipping container with wheels... you could even do Tandem load. Maybe utilizing the power of the large bus engines would increase efficiency/productivity?
Leave the 26,000lb+ heavy and Oversized loads to the Big rigs obviously...
Based on Random information found here : Fuel efficiency modes of transportation

Be somewhat of a good change overall?

Has anyone ever used recycled cooking oil for their Big Rig for lighter loads, or would it even be a viable option??

food for thought

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Old 03-21-2013, 02:34 PM   #2 (permalink)
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City buses and schol buses are two different animals. City buses must acomodate folks of all shapes and sizes, including handicapped. School buses largely acomodate able bodied children and do not allow standees, by law. I think we may see EV school buses soon. They generally don't need long range or high speeds and they stop and go a lot. Perfect for EVs. The only drawback is they must be heavy as they are built to amazing crash standards. School buses are absolute tanks.
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Old 03-21-2013, 05:46 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete c View Post
City buses and schol buses are two different animals. City buses must acomodate folks of all shapes and sizes, including handicapped. School buses largely acomodate able bodied children and do not allow standees, by law. I think we may see EV school buses soon. They generally don't need long range or high speeds and they stop and go a lot. Perfect for EVs. The only drawback is they must be heavy as they are built to amazing crash standards. School buses are absolute tanks.

School buses are made to acomodate various types of people too(including handicapped) and have been for a very long time. Older City buses had the same bench type seating the school buses still have today.

What would really be the difference between, say, a (kid/adult) stand-up riding in a city bus and stand-up riding in a school bus. Isn't the inherent "potential" danger the same? Even with or without influence of law... What logic did they use?
Assuming that Both types of buses meet the same Safety Crash requirements? but still...

Wouldn't it just be simplier/cheaper to design/build one base type of bus utilizing 1 particularly efficient mode of propultion. Rather than having two diff types that accomplish the same task (People carrier in this case) and one be less efficient, but it being a more used asset(city bus), instead of the more potentially efficient one?
Obviously, an EV bus small or large would be ideal, but seeing as this might not happen within the next decade? or so, why not improve ontop of whats already available...


Like i was mentioning, as local Cargo route trucks, from like local distribution centers to companies requiring specific loads, etc. you know kinda like UPS/Fedex delivery trucks, but with a bigger payload capacity. This would also mean more driving work as salary/hourly paid positions, rather than mileage paid drivers that would otherwise fail. Considering a Bus (loaded) compareble to an (ungodly common) box truck might just be more fuel efficient with accepted payloads.
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:39 AM   #4 (permalink)
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many school buses are LPG in Portland OR

http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy04osti/35769.pdf

though it does make for a one issue, when going to foot ball games over 150 miles round trip.
i think there hard pressed to get over 200 miles on a fill up.....
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:25 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RiderofBikes View Post
School buses are made to accommodate various types of people too(including handicapped) and have been for a very long time. Older City buses had the same bench type seating the school buses still have today.
Standard school buses are not made to accommodate handicapped. They have special buses for this. Older city buses did have this type of seating before ADA laws went into effect.

Quote:
What would really be the difference between, say, a (kid/adult) stand-up riding in a city bus and stand-up riding in a school bus. Isn't the inherent "potential" danger the same? Even with or without influence of law... What logic did they use?
since when did logic ever have anything to do with laws? The dangers are the same, but, for what ever reason, it has been determinded that it is OK to have people stand on city buses, but, not on school buses. Probably has to do with the drastically lowered number of seats on handicap accessible buses.

Quote:
Assuming that Both types of buses meet the same Safety Crash requirements? but still...

Wouldn't it just be simplier/cheaper to design/build one base type of bus utilizing 1 particularly efficient mode of propultion. Rather than having two diff types that accomplish the same task (People carrier in this case) and one be less efficient, but it being a more used asset(city bus), instead of the more potentially efficient one?
Obviously, an EV bus small or large would be ideal, but seeing as this might not happen within the next decade? or so, why not improve ontop of whats already available...
every hear the term, jack of all trades, master of none? this is what you propose. i am all for sharing platforms, when it makes sense. in this case it doesn't. ADA laws state that normal public trans buses be configured for handicap accessibility. school buses (for normal, highly mobile children) do not have this design restraint, nor should it. it costs a lot of money to make a bus that kneels at the curb to allow handicap access.


Quote:
Like i was mentioning, as local Cargo route trucks, from like local distribution centers to companies requiring specific loads, etc. you know kinda like UPS/Fedex delivery trucks, but with a bigger payload capacity. This would also mean more driving work as salary/hourly paid positions, rather than mileage paid drivers that would otherwise fail. Considering a Bus (loaded) compareble to an (ungodly common) box truck might just be more fuel efficient with accepted payloads.
Not exactly sure what it is you are saying. If you are talking about centralized trucking centers that make smaller deliveries with E trucks, I think that is a great idea. Another thing I would like to see is getting away from long distance OTR trucking. We have an existing network of rail. Every day thousands of individual trucks drag 53 foot boxes across the country. Why not have these boxes all strapped down to trains which can move them much more efficiently and safely between distribution centers. They could use the same container concept that is used by that moving company, PODS.

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