Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > EcoModding Central
Register Now
 Register Now
 

View Poll Results: Would you use a flammable refrigerant?
I'd consider it 18 81.82%
No way! 4 18.18%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-28-2019, 12:30 PM   #11 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Memphis, Tn
Posts: 463
Thanks: 320
Thanked 107 Times in 81 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ksa8907 View Post
Since it is the industry I work in, consider natural gas leaks. It is not very often they ignite, many go entirely unnoticed for years. Particularly on small leaks, the gas would dissipate so quickly to a percentage where it is no longer a threat.
Great point, thanks! However, there is a tiny difference here- Natural gas is less dense than air, so it floats up and dissipates. On the other hand, propane and butane are denser than air, so they tend to settle in low areas and concentrate. Realistically that probably wouldn’t be much of a factor here, but I figured I’d mention it anyways.

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to EcoCivic For This Useful Post:
ksa8907 (03-28-2019)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 03-28-2019, 12:41 PM   #12 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Memphis, Tn
Posts: 463
Thanks: 320
Thanked 107 Times in 81 Posts
Another idea

I am going to get a Mishimoto fan shroud kit for my car to help improve airflow through the radiators. Not just to help the AC operate more efficiently at low speeds, but also to help the engine cool better in traffic and at low speeds. Even with my Mishimoto radiator, the coolant sometimes heats up to around 210 degrees with both fans running when I am sitting in traffic with the AC on on a very hot day, which I don’t like.

Then there is the question of the extra power the Mishimoto fans would draw would be worth it for MPG. I would say yes, but I’m not certain. I can’t imagine that the Mishimoto fans would draw that much more power than the OEM fans do, but since they would improve airflow and therefore improve the efficiency of the AC system, but I am not certain.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2019, 12:58 PM   #13 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 1,745

Volt, gas only - '12 Chevrolet Volt Premium
90 day: 38.02 mpg (US)

Volt, electric only - '12 Chevrolet Volt Premium
90 day: 132.26 mpg (US)

Yukon Denali Hybrid - '12 GMC Yukon Denali Hybrid
90 day: 21.48 mpg (US)
Thanks: 206
Thanked 420 Times in 302 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by EcoCivic View Post
Great point, thanks! However, there is a tiny difference here- Natural gas is less dense than air, so it floats up and dissipates. On the other hand, propane and butane are denser than air, so they tend to settle in low areas and concentrate. Realistically that probably wouldn’t be much of a factor here, but I figured I’d mention it anyways.
Also gasoline vapors. It's good to be aware of the difference but if you've got a propane leak or NG leak in your garage it gets addressed in the same manner. Open a door or window and let it vent.
__________________




  Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2019, 01:07 PM   #14 (permalink)
Human Environmentalist
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 12,390

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 24.19 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 26.68 mpg (US)

Chevy ZR-2 - '03 Chevrolet S10 ZR2
90 day: 17.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,187
Thanked 4,378 Times in 3,353 Posts
Flammable refrigerant kills 2 stones with 1 bird. Efficient cooling when needed, and instant heat when it bursts into flames!

Kidding aside, I'd consider it. The chance of fire seems pretty low, and the amount of refrigerant low enough that even if it did leak out and catch on fire, shouldn't do much damage.

I've shot camping propane bottles in a fire before, and it doesn't do much. Same with butane.
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
Daschicken (03-29-2019), EcoCivic (03-28-2019)
Old 03-28-2019, 01:11 PM   #15 (permalink)
EcoModding flying lizard
 
Daschicken's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Georgia
Posts: 742

Cibbie - '88 Honda CBR 250R
Motorcycle
90 day: 48.49 mpg (US)

Rarity - '06 Honda Accord EX V6
Team Honda
90 day: 29.88 mpg (US)

Baby viff - '86 Honda VFR 400R
Motorcycle
90 day: 42.15 mpg (US)

Latios - '08 Suzuki SV650SF
Motorcycle
90 day: 64.56 mpg (US)

Mazda 3 - '14 Mazda 3 i Sport
90 day: 43.25 mpg (US)
Thanks: 618
Thanked 261 Times in 174 Posts
Coolant is flammable, oil is flammable, power steering and transmission fluid are flammable (my car had a PS hose recall for this reason), oil is flammable, and gas is VERY flammable. A little bit of propane shouldn’t be too scary.

That being said, you should keep one of these in your car anyways.


If you use a dry powder extinguisher, make sure to tip it back and forth every once in a while to prevent the powder from clumping on the bottom. You should be able to hear and feel it moving.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	7D5F7632-95F7-4CDD-A20F-CD7C5D49CE3D.jpg
Views:	263
Size:	53.8 KB
ID:	25713  
__________________
-Kaze o tatakaimasen-

Best trip in V6: 52.0
Best tank in V6: 46.0
Best tank in Mazda: 49.9
Best tank in CBR: 61.3
Best tank in SV: 83.9

Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG View Post
You can lead a fashion-conscious horse to unusual-looking water...

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Daschicken For This Useful Post:
EcoCivic (03-28-2019)
Old 03-28-2019, 01:17 PM   #16 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Memphis, Tn
Posts: 463
Thanks: 320
Thanked 107 Times in 81 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
Flammable refrigerant kills 2 stones with 1 bird. Efficient cooling when needed, and instant heat when it bursts into flames!

Kidding aside, I'd consider it. The chance of fire seems pretty low, and the amount of refrigerant low enough that even if it did leak out and catch on fire, shouldn't do much damage.
Lol thanks. However, if this video is real, I disagree that there isn’t enough refrigerant in the system to do much damage in the unlikely scenario where all of the gas leaks out into a confined space.

I think that the most dangerous (although extremely unlikely) scenario would be if the evaporator bursts while the car is parked and fills the car with flammable gas. Then the owner of the car gets in and starts it without knowing anything happened, and the spark from the ignition switch ignites the gas, causing an explosion while the driver is in the car. Again, I think that would be very unlikely though.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2019, 01:42 PM   #17 (permalink)
Human Environmentalist
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 12,390

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 24.19 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 26.68 mpg (US)

Chevy ZR-2 - '03 Chevrolet S10 ZR2
90 day: 17.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,187
Thanked 4,378 Times in 3,353 Posts
Meh, that mannequin seemed hardly phased, and I'm sure I've done worse to myself. Eyebrows grow back.
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
EcoCivic (03-28-2019), pete c (04-14-2019)
Old 03-29-2019, 08:58 AM   #18 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Memphis, Tn
Posts: 463
Thanks: 320
Thanked 107 Times in 81 Posts
Window tint

I frogot to mention that I also had the side and back window tinted with 3M Crystalline 40% window tint, which helped a lot. I am hopefully going to get the windshield tinted with the same but the 70% version. Not only will it help to keep the car cooler, but it will also help keep me from getting blinded by the sun
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2019, 11:38 AM   #19 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: elizabethtown, KY USA
Posts: 14
Thanks: 15
Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts
Send a message via Yahoo to jeff5may
The refrigeration industry has been having a very hard time in the last few decades. The patents have run out on the current batch of gases and the profit margin has dropped. Considering the gwp issue, along with flammable gas concerns, there are not many viable options. R-410a was a stretch back when it got vetted.

In Europe and Asia, the powers that be have decided that stuff like propane and butane is ok for small appliances. The commercial market is especially all in on building refrigerator and freezer units that are filled with hydrocarbon refrigerant. The supermarket industry is leaning on the government to increase the limit on the refrigerant charge, so they can run the freezer aisle and back of house coolers with natural refrigerant.

Last edited by jeff5may; 04-13-2019 at 11:58 AM..
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to jeff5may For This Useful Post:
EcoCivic (04-13-2019), pete c (04-14-2019)
Old 04-13-2019, 02:24 PM   #20 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
teoman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 1,245

A3 - '12 Audi A3
Thanks: 65
Thanked 225 Times in 186 Posts
Natural?

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to teoman For This Useful Post:
EcoCivic (04-13-2019)
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com