Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Aerodynamics
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 09-26-2014, 09:28 PM   #31 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
freebeard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 28,715
Thanks: 8,150
Thanked 8,929 Times in 7,372 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xist
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtamiyaphile
Problem could be solved with a dry sump, which could easily lower an engine the required 20mm instead.
Lowering the center of gravity is good.
...hence my avatar pic.

  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 09-27-2014, 12:13 AM   #32 (permalink)
Not banned yet
 
deejaaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Texas Coast, close to Houston
Posts: 907

Blue - '03 Chevy S-10, LS
Thanks: 423
Thanked 266 Times in 213 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by u.steinlechner View Post
...........What do you think about the design and wich car model should be the first for a serial produced bumper....
the MK4 Jetta, AKA Bora, of course.
__________________
2003 S-10, 2.2L, 5 speed, ext cab long bed.
So far: DRL delete, remove bed mount toolbox.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2014, 08:50 PM   #33 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
NeilBlanchard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,908

Mica Blue - '05 Scion xA RS 2.0
Team Toyota
90 day: 42.48 mpg (US)

Forest - '15 Nissan Leaf S
Team Nissan
90 day: 156.46 mpg (US)

Number 7 - '15 VW e-Golf SEL
TEAM VW AUDI Group
90 day: 155.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,475
Thanked 2,952 Times in 1,845 Posts
Does the nose function as an aerodynamic improvement? The Mercedes Bionic (aka the Boxfish) has a similar nose and it does seem to have a benefit - maybe to initiate the motion of the air, since it is the first portion of the car to push it aside.
__________________
Sincerely, Neil

http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2014, 05:10 PM   #34 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Germany
Posts: 23
Thanks: 7
Thanked 49 Times in 13 Posts
Wind tunel results

Hi,

this are the results from the measurement in the windtunnel.

Ulrich


CW Wiederstand drag
CA Auftrieb gesamt lift
Cav Auftrieb vorne lift front
Cah Auftrieb hinten lift rear



Serienzustand, Original, radiator grill open
speed 140 km/h
CW 0,323
CA 0,0402
CAv -0,0223
CAh 0,0626



Xanon aerodynamic bumper with vortex generator, air intake open
speed 140 km/h
CW 0,2971
CA 0,0256
CAv -0,1053
CAh 0,1309


Xanon aerodynamic bumper without vortex generator, air intake open
speed 140 km/h
CW 0,2961
CA 0,0213
CAv -0,097
CAh 0,1184
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2014, 05:48 PM   #35 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Germany
Posts: 23
Thanks: 7
Thanked 49 Times in 13 Posts
Bionic methods

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard View Post
Does the nose function as an aerodynamic improvement? The Mercedes Bionic (aka the Boxfish) has a similar nose and it does seem to have a benefit - maybe to initiate the motion of the air, since it is the first portion of the car to push it aside.
Hi Neil,

the nose is a improvement.
By replacing only of the bumper and radiator grill, aerodynamics improve dramatic.
See wind tunnel results

But it is not based on the boxfish.

In my concept, two bionic shapes are used.

On the upper side, the nose of the penguin as (Stufenvorlaufkörper) to accelerate and slow down the air several times bevor it reache the main body.

On the bottom, the stingray have good characteristics in the ground effect.
So the bumper is the synthesis of several requirements and bionic solutions.


Bionic is the science of copying nature for technical applications

The nose is the result from what I have learned from my "Xanon X1" concept.


Image: Xanon X1

The air intake is the result of studies of air intake in front of the wheels, because wheels can make 30% of aerodynamic drag.

(But designers like to show big wheels)

Last but not least, it is not important to model the shape of the car, but the distribution of pressure in front of the car.

Rule: Aerodynamics starts not at the object but in a distance befor.

Ulrich
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to u.steinlechner For This Useful Post:
BamZipPow (10-02-2014), NeilBlanchard (09-30-2014)
Old 09-29-2014, 06:43 PM   #36 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
aerohead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sanger,Texas,U.S.A.
Posts: 16,314
Thanks: 24,440
Thanked 7,386 Times in 4,783 Posts
bumper bionics

It seems like the bumper serves to minimize the airflow volume through the cooling system,harvest the remaining cooling air from a lowered frontal stagnation location,while limiting stagnation pressure from the base underside of the original M-B nose,thereby restricting underbody flow.All good!
The airflow would be deforming well in advance of the car even without the new nose,as Ludwig Prandtl reported on in the 1920s,with his 'lines of discontinuity.'
Here you can see it with the Schl'o'rwagen

The quasi-NACA inlet at the driver's side upper grille location brings in the rest of the needed air.
It's a stylish way to kill a couple birds with the same stone.
__________________
Photobucket album: http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj622/aerohead2/
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to aerohead For This Useful Post:
BamZipPow (10-02-2014), u.steinlechner (09-30-2014)
Old 09-30-2014, 04:07 AM   #37 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Germany
Posts: 23
Thanks: 7
Thanked 49 Times in 13 Posts
Hi aerohead,

the picture of the Schlör car shows smoke probes in the center line of the car.

The center line is a special place for nice pictures.

More important is the area beside the center line because the airflow will swap to the side of the car.



Ulrich
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to u.steinlechner For This Useful Post:
aerohead (10-03-2014)
Old 09-30-2014, 04:43 AM   #38 (permalink)
Not Doug
 
Xist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Show Low, AZ
Posts: 12,240

Chorizo - '00 Honda Civic HX, baby! :D
90 day: 35.35 mpg (US)

Mid-Life Crisis Fighter - '99 Honda Accord LX
90 day: 34.2 mpg (US)

Gramps - '04 Toyota Camry LE
90 day: 35.39 mpg (US)

Don't hit me bro - '05 Toyota Camry LE
90 day: 30.49 mpg (US)
Thanks: 7,254
Thanked 2,233 Times in 1,723 Posts
How do you prevent hydrolock?
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2014, 05:53 AM   #39 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Germany
Posts: 23
Thanks: 7
Thanked 49 Times in 13 Posts
Hi Xist,

the low air intake are only for the heat exchanger.

The air intake for the engine are in the origin height.

You can see it instead of the the radiator grill.

This air intake for the engine can also be a cause for the fuel efficiency, because there could be a higher pressure and airflow.



Ulrich
  Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to u.steinlechner For This Useful Post:
aerohead (10-03-2014), BamZipPow (10-02-2014), Xist (09-30-2014)
Old 10-12-2014, 06:03 PM   #40 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: France - Paris
Posts: 762

la_voiture_de_courses - '03 Renault Megane Estate
OldContinents
90 day: 44.34 mpg (US)

xiao lan - '01 Audi A2
90 day: 38.88 mpg (US)

Brit iron - '92 Mini Mini
90 day: 45.5 mpg (US)

Prius - '09 Toyota PRIUS Lounge
90 day: 47.37 mpg (US)

Beemer - '06 BMW F800 ST
90 day: 53.06 mpg (US)
Thanks: 188
Thanked 33 Times in 30 Posts
Cool developement !

Can we have a glance underneath ?

__________________
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Tags
aerodynamic, bionic, bumper, fuelsave, xanon





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com