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Old 05-15-2008, 12:48 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by dcb View Post
There is some info here, but it doesn't look like a straight forward PID mapping and has vehicle specific settings for gear ratio:
I don't know xgauge, so all I can say is maybe, do some experimenting, good luck, and report back
just got off the phone with scanguage customer support, told me that ron is out of town for now and that he'll be back on monday... you say "his latest version allowes you to display any pid you want", what did you mean by "his latest version" ??? does he have a newer scanguage firmware or are you talking about the new scan guage itself (xguage) ?

anywho I've been told that I cant find anything out till ron gets back, so I'll be talking to him on monday, stay tuned folks!

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Old 05-15-2008, 01:14 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by blackjackel View Post
..you say "his latest version allowes you to display any pid you want"...
I said *unless* it does allow you to display any pid you want, I have no idea, I don't have his latest version that he is shipping.
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Old 05-15-2008, 01:34 PM   #13 (permalink)
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With the xgauge you can display any pid you want. The tough part is just getting a hold of how to interpret the response and display it properly.

Have a look at this Xgauge coding document.

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Old 05-15-2008, 02:01 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by blackjackel View Post
Just came back from a quick wikipedia read of torque converters, and with my basic and limited understanding I ask: How can I tell if my torque converter has locked? How can I tell when it has unlocked? And are you saying that I should drive as slow as possible with it locked (highway)?

Also, for city, are you saying I shouldn't accelerate slow? I should give it a good push to get the torque converter to lock early? (not floor it, but yeah).
As you probably read a torque converter is basically a subsitute for a manual clutch, so it allows you to idle in gear, gives you a smooth start from a stop.
They basically work like a turbine connected to the engine throwing oil at a turbine connected to the transmission. As you can imagine their is always some difference in the speeds of the two turbines which is wasted energy. So to get good mpg they have converters that lock the turbines together and have no waste. Most cars only do this in top gear although I believe some do this in every gear (old mazda 626's).
Watch your rpms as you get up to speed on the highway, your car will shift into top gear and then shortly after the rpm's will drop a couple hundred rpm more and now the converter is locked. Now rpms move in lockstep with the speedometer. There is no slippage so your not losing hp into the converter.

Also torque converters are more efficient at higher rpms so using 30% throttle gets some revs going and less slippage therefore less waste and you get up to top gear and locked quicker.

With the automatics we can't give 60% throttle at 2000rpm in every gear like many here so we can't always run our engines in the most efficient way but we can pulse and glide just as efficiently in top gear if the converter is locked.
Once you know what to look for you will easily be able to tell when the converter is locked.
Your car might lock the converter in every gear too which is much harder to detect so an Xgauge showing this would be useful. I think you'd find that you get lock at 3000rpm for example then you know to make the engine rev more on acceleration.
Hope this helps,

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Old 05-15-2008, 04:42 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Find a pinout diagram for your transmission's wiring harness. By tapping one or more of the proper solenoid wires, you can get an LED to glow when you're in top gear. Don't attempt this if you think you'll screw something up.
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Old 05-15-2008, 06:29 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Just through observation and the shop manual, I've noted the following in the Integra:

-TC happens at 35 mph or higher (at full operating temp)
-There are 3 levels of TC lockup: partial, half, and full
-Gears 2-4 are effected
-Hill logic control is independent of lockup

The last point helps me know about lockup behavior. Climbing a hill or on-ramp, the TCU will hold the 3rd gear, for example (unless the throttle is lifted). The the unit will then determine that a constant RPM allows some degree of lockup.

The telltale is the shift to 4th. In most vehicles, shifting gears in lockup is jolting -- the full force of the engine output is placed on that gear change (no cushion from the converter). Some cars perform a brief unlock, shift, re-lock -- which is still noticeable and often a hard shift.

Another "seat of the pants" way to tell if you're in lock is to give the vehicle a little throttle pressure and back off. If the tach gently moves 100-200 RPM or more, it's generally not locked (if not, then it shifted out). If I EOC, the TCU gets rather confused and denies lockup until such distance that the Math checks out for the hill-logic control. During full warmup and no EOC, TC lock is deliberate and noticeable right at 35.

I tend to get up to TC lock (35 mph) briskly -- since the ECU retards the timing on every upshift for a "smoother" engagement, FE drops at each shift. It's built-in and I can't do anything about it -- it's probably not a lot.

Some cars react differently, but I've tightened the throttle linkage to the max extent. This creates more fluid pressure for tighter shifts, earlier (and more noticeable). Some will argue that it causes earlier kickdown. It all depends if the vehicle has an aggressive Transmission Control Unit -- in my case it doesn't. I'm also told that harder shifts are better than slipping ones for longevity.

BTW, what kind of car? GM generally has a smooth, sliding action to their TCs and unlock with the slightest lift...


“If we knew what we were doing, it wouldn't be called research” ― Albert Einstein

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