Bicycle pics - post them up

[Bicycle Bob]

I use a lot more ferrous oxide camouflage on my bike. The shifters are on the steering tube, offset for the right hand. So, I can turn the handlebars 90 deg right and catch the center-pull brake lever on them, locking the front brake and allowing the bike to stand against any handy curb or stone. It can also stand on one toe clip. It is 43 years old, with over 100,000 miles on it, and I just discovered that the fork is badly offset, but not damaged. If I'd built it, I'd have scrapped it quick, but it never bothered me (until now.)

The trike was built to demonstrate full integration of frame and suspension, and test out the 1 + 1/2 seating and general packaging.
https://www.compositesworld.com/colu...mobile-history

[MetroMPG]

What does the writing on the high-vis tail rudder say?

[Bicycle Bob]

Originally Posted by MetroMPG

What does the writing on the high-vis tail rudder say?

Below the tail fin the builders and sponsors are listed. There is no writing on the "Safety Sail" but it has fluorescent stripes separating amber lights which flash up and down in time with the pedals, giving the same general impression as pedal reflectors. The streamlined section has less drag than a thin round flagpole, and nothing flapping on top. In a crosswind, it swings to catch the wind and pay back the usual small drag, as well as stabilize the trike.

The fin easily detaches for standing the trike on its back wheel and locking the frame to a pole.

[The Toecutter]

Originally Posted by Bicycle Bob

The trike was built to demonstrate full integration of frame and suspension, and test out the 1 + 1/2 seating and general packaging.

Do you still have that trike? If so, how often do you ride it? What kind of cruising speed and top speed were you able to obtain while riding it? Any reliability issues? How many miles have been placed on it?

Most importantly, do you have any plans to make another enclosed trike or something like it, and if so, what will you be making?

[Bicycle Bob]

Originally Posted by The Toecutter

Do you still have that trike? If so, how often do you ride it? What kind of cruising speed and top speed were you able to obtain while riding it? Any reliability issues? How many miles have been placed on it?

Most importantly, do you have any plans to make another enclosed trike or something like it, and if so, what will you be making?

I still have it, but I'd rather build a new one than restore it to running order. It was built for research, not easy maintenance, and ran about 1,400 miles farther than intended, mostly developing cosmetic issues. It ran 20% faster than a bike with the front intake open, and 30% faster with the cooling reduced. I was officially timed at 30 MPH with no hill or wind, but I'm no athlete. Better detailing would raise that considerably.

I planned my life around putting it into production, but never found the capital. More details at: https://microship.com/bob-stuart/ mixed in with other research articles and history.

[The Toecutter]

Originally Posted by Bicycle Bob

I still have it, but I'd rather build a new one than restore it to running order. It was built for research, not easy maintenance, and ran about 1,400 miles farther than intended, mostly developing cosmetic issues. It ran 20% faster than a bike with the front intake open, and 30% faster with the cooling reduced. I was officially timed at 30 MPH with no hill or wind, but I'm no athlete. Better detailing would raise that considerably.

I planned my life around putting it into production, but never found the capital. More details at: https://microship.com/bob-stuart/ mixed in with other research articles and history.

I know exactly how it is to not have capital for anything. Even getting a first prototype put together is beyond most peoples' financial means. I had prototypes I designed in high school that went unbuilt or remain unfinished due to a lack of money(and it was admittedly modest amounts compared to things people in the upper 25% of income/wealth commonly waste money on, let alone what the rich waste money on). What was your intended price point were it to have been put in production and at what year? How much do you think something like this could be built for today, in terms of dollars for the parts, dollars for the use of tools, and how many hours of labor?

Your Car Cycle is an inspiration with regards to what can be done with the concept of a bicycle. It was an idea well ahead of its time, and its time is coming fast. Just having the knowledge that you have puts you ahead of the curve. A lack of capital means you may not get the chance to take the opportunity, and that really sucks. If you can, you should definitely build a new one and use it as a daily rider, just to show what kind of reliability can be had with the design. Prove the concept works, is usable on an everyday basis, and is reliable by racking some miles up on it.

Coroplast is a good material for a prototype body, but it does not lend itself well to long-term use without those cosmetic issues developing. Over a long period of time, it sort of begins to behave like a liquid instead of a solid, and any load-bearing pieces will begin to warp and lose their stiffness. The first coroplast shell I made lasted almost 2 years before it started developing a harmonic wobble during high speed riding that turned what used to be a stable vehicle at speed into a nightmare to control at speed, and this current coroplast shell I recently posted a picture of uses aluminum braces bolted to it to stiffen it. I'm hoping it will last long enough for me to build a permanent shell, since this coroplast shell was made just to get the shape right, since the first shells aerodynamics left a lot to be desired and had other issues. I'm going to move onto either fiberglass or carbon fiber and make a compound-curved near-replica of the shell out of such, once I get the aerodynamics, ergonomics, and clearances the way I want them.

After that, I'm going to give building a fully custom steel chassis with full suspension a go, and build a pedal/electric/solar velomobile/sports car hybrid completely from the ground up. The goal is a total finished weight of around 100-120 lbs, capability of safely holding highway speeds(DOT wheels/tires), acceleration from 0-60 mph in under 5 seconds, top speed around 100 mph, light/efficient enough to be pedaled faster than an ordinary bicycle with the drive system shut completely off, operable as a pedelec or with throttle, 20 Wh/mile @ 70 mph with 150W rider input, ability to hold 1G lateral acceleration without tipping over, small enough to fit in a bike lane(< 40" wide). a 2 kWh battery pack, and a 100W or larger solar array built into the body.

[Bicycle Bob]

Originally Posted by The Toecutter

<snip> What was your intended price point were it to have been put in production and at what year? How much do you think something like this could be built for today, in terms of dollars for the parts, dollars for the use of tools, and how many hours of labor?

A: I was expecting to price them for $5,000 in 1990, by selling molds to regional producers of kits for local assembly. I have not done any recent estimates, but the usual tradeoff between investment in tooling vs providing jobs is quite applicable, as are economies of scale.

<snip> If you can, you should definitely build a new one and use it as a daily rider, just to show what kind of reliability can be had with the design. Prove the concept works, is usable on an everyday basis, and is reliable by racking some miles up on it.

A: Sadly, to maintain a workshop, I moved to an area of no commuting. I walk to stores and ride for exercise, seen only by farmers and occasional cottagers. I might build a version that can be built from plans instead of molds, though. Still, there are many velomobiles on the road showing practicality, and it would take a multi-talented team to add mass appeal to any design. My specialty is reducing the parts count. If I were going into business today, I would produce components for trikes first, to take 5 lbs off the usual adaptations from bicycling. With revenue from parts, we could work on the rest.

Q: Coroplast is a good material for a prototype body, but it does not lend itself well to long-term use without those cosmetic issues developing. Over a long period of time, it sort of begins to behave like a liquid instead of a solid, and any load-bearing pieces will begin to warp and lose their stiffness. The first coroplast shell I made lasted almost 2 years before it started developing a harmonic wobble during high speed riding that turned what used to be a stable vehicle at speed into a nightmare to control at speed, and this current coroplast shell I recently posted a picture of uses aluminum braces bolted to it to stiffen it. I'm hoping it will last long enough for me to build a permanent shell, since this coroplast shell was made just to get the shape right, since the first shells aerodynamics left a lot to be desired and had other issues. I'm going to move onto either fiberglass or carbon fiber and make a compound-curved near-replica of the shell out of such, once I get the aerodynamics, ergonomics, and clearances the way I want them.

A: My link includes details on a much lighter Coroplast body that turned out to be astonishingly rugged. I have never had trouble with stress points creeping, but I'm pretty fussy about local reinforcing. I think that there is a lot of potential for vacuum-formed Coroplast, but I really prefer John Tetz's use of semi-rigid foam instead, because Coroplast is so noisy with road rumble. Perhaps isolation mounts would cure that, but that adds structure and weight. The foam would need a thick Urethane paint to look shiny.

For regular use at highway speed, I'd like to try several layers of coroplast strips, laid up like a molded plywood boat hull but without the careful edge butting - more like a non-woven basket. Basic silicon seal at each crossing makes a good bond, and the holes let it cure. Then a light coat of foam and 'glass gives a slick finish over a full-body helmet. Carbon is the wrong way to go - a fairing needs toughness since it can't afford the weight of total invulnerability.

Q: After that, I'm going to give building a fully custom steel chassis with full suspension a go, and build a pedal/electric/solar velomobile/sports car hybrid completely from the ground up. The goal is a total finished weight of around 100-120 lbs, capability of safely holding highway speeds(DOT wheels/tires), acceleration from 0-60 mph in under 5 seconds, top speed around 100 mph, light/efficient enough to be pedaled faster than an ordinary bicycle with the drive system shut completely off, operable as a pedelec or with throttle, 20 Wh/mile @ 70 mph with 150W rider input, ability to hold 1G lateral acceleration without tipping over, small enough to fit in a bike lane(< 40" wide). a 2 kWh battery pack, and a 100W or larger solar array built into the body.

I like it, but I'd like it more with integrated frame and suspension. Why build something rigid when flexible is lighter and more functional? It could be done in steel, but you'd have to really enjoy advanced metalwork.

1g lateral sounds wonderful for conserving momentum, but in the real world, you seldom get to use it without bothering people. To stay narrow for filtering and passing man-doors, I'm seriously tempted by the complications of a tilting mechanism. In any case, I think that .6 g is sufficient. It has the advantage that you can practice approaching it frequently, and those reflexes are probably better than ultimate performance in a sudden crisis. You get much less rolling resistance with relaxed traction demands, too.

I would also recommend paying serious attention to directional stability. With such a light, fast, streamlined form, traction becomes unreliable. Aim to have a stable glider fuselage that usually stays on the ground, but does not yaw in a crosswind gust, even on wet ice. It just moves over.

[freebeard]

Polymetal [or equivalent].

Supposedly, the strength of 5/8" plywood with 1/10th the weight. The samples were sheared, rolled and braked by hand on a brake with an 18" lever arm. The white strip is an H-shaped plastic strip joining two pieces. The 90° brake ruptured. It needed scoring on the inside or something.

The thing I like is it's pre-finished.

[The Toecutter]

Originally Posted by Bicycle Bob

I like it, but I'd like it more with integrated frame and suspension. Why build something rigid when flexible is lighter and more functional? It could be done in steel, but you'd have to really enjoy advanced metalwork.

I like things to be repairable/replaceable at the component level if need be. I do not want a suspension integrated into the frame because if the suspension fails or I get into a minor accident, I'd like the odds to be likely that I can repair it with standard parts, and not have to replace the entire vehicle.

1g lateral sounds wonderful for conserving momentum, but in the real world, you seldom get to use it without bothering people.

I'm considering this from both a performance and safety standpoint.

To stay narrow for filtering and passing man-doors, I'm seriously tempted by the complications of a tilting mechanism.

Tilting mechanisms are very difficult to get working. I'm going to avoid bothering with that for the near-term future. It's also another part to fail. This can be made up for with proper design of chassis geometry, sufficient wheelbase and width, at the expense of turning radius and overall agility.

In any case, I think that .6 g is sufficient.

Certainly. Most trikes/velomobiles will tip at around 0.5G, but they are also much more narrow than 40".

You get much less rolling resistance with relaxed traction demands, too.

If the tires are the limiting factor regarding traction, the vehicle will skid instead of tip, in most cases. So having a tipping point of 1G while the tires can handle up to 0.85G before skidding would still be great. LRR tires with poor traction in cornering would basically mean the vehicle was tip-proof in normal operating conditions, which is highly desirable.

I would also recommend paying serious attention to directional stability. With such a light, fast, streamlined form, traction becomes unreliable. Aim to have a stable glider fuselage that usually stays on the ground, but does not yaw in a crosswind gust, even on wet ice. It just moves over.

All agreed. Downforce will certainly be a consideration here as well. The tail will have to taper to a fine point, and the sides will have to be designed to break up crosswinds. Center of gravity will also have to be as close as possible to the center of pressure, preferably with both slightly behind the front wheel axle line.

I just took my current build out for another 15 mile ride today. It is stable going 40+ mph downhill with side gusts of 15+ mph. I barely notice side winds impacting my directional stability at all, and the body shell acts as an excellent sail for any side/tail winds the way I designed it.

I'm looking forward to fairing the front wheels! That will be the next large gain in efficiency to be had.

Everything I've learned with this design is going to be transferred to a custom car. The concept of a 1,000+ MPGe electric car that can accelerate like a high end motorcycle is just too alluring, as is a velomobile variant that can move like a car and still be pedaled like a bike with everything shut off. One could literally go for tens of miles on just one cent of electricity in either of such a thing. Part of the reason I developed an affinity for bicycles was their simplicity and low cost of operation,in addition to their fun factor. Whatever cars I design are going to reflect those attributes as a design philosophy.

[Bicycle Bob]

^^ I have openings on both sides to help spoil any aero side forces. I'd also consider a fairly abrupt transition from front to side panels, such that the flow only stays attached in a moderate crosswind. Of course, you have to keep the center of pressure from wandering too far in the transition as well.