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Old 07-30-2018, 07:23 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowmover View Post
I’d argue it makes sense when the vehicle in question makes sense. A sedan of sufficient size (Charger/300). They at least are amenable to FE concious Driving. A pickup is only such when bed fully loaded (fulfilling its purpose).

Specifying the vehicle to the job puts MPG barely into the top five. It’s the type, then reliability and longevity. Brand differences are where MPG pops up. After drivetrain.

.
A sedan of sufficient size for what? Winning the arms race for biggest/heaviest vehicle? You can get a fairly recent model Rolls Royce which weighs in at a very safe 6000lbs for less than most Ford Rangers are going for these days, and it should easily wreck any other car on the road in case of a serious accident.

In all seriousness, most people in the US use their primary vehicle for hauling a single person back and forth to work 15-20 miles each way, twice per day, and to carry a few bags of groceries, an occasional trip with 3-4 people to the local mall or theater, and a very occasional trip to visit relatives to eat turkey or exchange colorfully wrapped boxes. It's a minority of people who need anything more than the space to carry home that new grill, above ground pool or 60" TV they buy at Lowes/Walmart once per year. If truck/SUV ownership reflected truck/SUV need, it would likely be <10%.

As an anecdote, my neighbor was asking about my Insight. I've gutted the back so it has around (what I'd estimate) 40 cubic feet of cargo space. He commented that while the reliability and fuel economy sound nice, it probably wouldn't work for him because it wouldn't be able to hold all of his dirty laundry he drives around with every day.


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Old 07-30-2018, 02:29 PM   #12 (permalink)
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GM's V8s since the late '90s have all been based on the same LS architecture. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LS_bas...l-block_engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
As an anecdote, my neighbor was asking about my Insight. I've gutted the back so it has around (what I'd estimate) 40 cubic feet of cargo space. He commented that while the reliability and fuel economy sound nice, it probably wouldn't work for him because it wouldn't be able to hold all of his dirty laundry he drives around with every day.
Literal dirty laundry? That must smell nice after a hot day.
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Old 07-30-2018, 02:46 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Carmakers don't do what is best for anyone else. They do not make the best cars for the environment, people's finances, or to minimize road congestion. Manufacturers and dealership only want to make as much money as possible. Do they attempt to accomplish this by selling $13,000 lunchboxes with manual transmissions, windows, seats, and an AM radio? No, they hardly stock their cheapest cars. You tell yourself that you want one and you are going to save money, gas, and space. Shucks! They are all out! Well, the next-smallest is only a couple thousand more, is only a little bigger, and gets almost the same fuel economy!

Then the salesman convinces you that you need the luxury package and perhaps upgrade to an even larger vehicle, which is only a little more expensive, and a little less fuel efficient.

If the dealership does have the $13,000 car in stock, hardly anyone will want it, it is not designed to attract buyers, but they can say they offered a small, inexpensive, and fuel-efficient car, but nobody wanted it.

Yes, in the United States people generally want larger things than people in other countries. People here are taller than in many countries, so to a point it is reasonable. I always figured that people in Afghanistan were small and short was because they could not afford enough food. They also drove thirty year-old Corollas because it was all they could afford.

People in the U.S. have Affluenza, or just more available credit than sense. Purchase a vehicle they can afford with cash? [Excuses] They purchase the most expensive thing they can finance.

Then they will trade it in before it is paid off.

A while ago we compared a Camry and some Toyota SUV. I forget which. The two vehicles were comparable in every way, except you can wear your giant sombrero for Cinco de Mayo.

Sold!

Why doesn't the Camry get significantly better fuel economy than the SUV? The only math that adds up is that they have a larger profit margin in the larger vehicle and are successfully convincing customers to go that way.
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Old 07-30-2018, 02:51 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Why does your neighbor transport hundreds of pounds of dirty laundry every day? Is this freshly dirty laundry or the same stuff forever?

I do not have hundreds of pounds of clothing...
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Old 07-30-2018, 03:09 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Well, the Corvette has something like a 6.2L V8 and it is rated for 28 MPG highway. Aerodynamics has more to do with efficiency than engine size or vehicle weight.
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Old 07-30-2018, 03:46 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Which Corvette is that? I looked at the Z06 Coupe with 1/2/3LZ and each of them was rated 15/22.
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Old 07-30-2018, 03:49 PM   #17 (permalink)
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My bad, I read it from Wiki. Likely not rated for that, but able to achieve. Model C5

"The new engine, combined with the new body and its low 0.29 drag coefficient, was able to achieve up to 28 mpg on the highway."
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Old 08-02-2018, 04:30 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowmover View Post
Until some recent point in time, the engine lineup for pickups was a shorter version of those for cars.
Except for heavy-duty Diesels, it seems like this trend has not changed much. Toyota might be the only one effectively challenging this sort of "tradition" with the TR engine series which only car application was the JDM Toyota Comfort.
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Old 08-03-2018, 01:34 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
A sedan of sufficient size for what? Winning the arms race for biggest/heaviest vehicle? You can get a fairly recent model Rolls Royce which weighs in at a very safe 6000lbs for less than most Ford Rangers are going for these days, and it should easily wreck any other car on the road in case of a serious accident.

In all seriousness, most people in the US use their primary vehicle for hauling a single person back and forth to work 15-20 miles each way, twice per day, and to carry a few bags of groceries, an occasional trip with 3-4 people to the local mall or theater, and a very occasional trip to visit relatives to eat turkey or exchange colorfully wrapped boxes. It's a minority of people who need anything more than the space to carry home that new grill, above ground pool or 60" TV they buy at Lowes/Walmart once per year. If truck/SUV ownership reflected truck/SUV need, it would likely be <10%.

As an anecdote, my neighbor was asking about my Insight. I've gutted the back so it has around (what I'd estimate) 40 cubic feet of cargo space. He commented that while the reliability and fuel economy sound nice, it probably wouldn't work for him because it wouldn't be able to hold all of his dirty laundry he drives around with every day.
You really should try to read.
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Old 08-03-2018, 01:39 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I understand, people want bigger vehicles, except when they can't finance a vehicle the size they want or fuel economy is too low.

I probably shouldn't try to second-guess what people want. It's a free country.

EDIT: My apologies, I think I was in a bad mood when I wrote that post.

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