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Old 09-21-2012, 06:43 PM   #11 (permalink)
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front airbags only increase your chance of surviving a crash by 1%; don't know about side airbags though. but that one percent could be the difference between death and coma/brain damage.

surviving doesn't mean you walk away from the crash unharmed

the first gen airbags were dangerous to anyone sitting too close to them(under 5'5")

that and airbags were chosen because the general public thinks 4 and 5 point harness are complicated, expensive, retarded, don't want to feel like they are strapped into a jet fighter.

they'd prefer a loaded gun pointed at them instead.

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Old 09-21-2012, 07:12 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Seriously? I live 10 min south of buffalo and have never had abs. I only have 7 years of driving experience, I'm young, stupid, and I speed a lot. I have NEVER gotten into an accident in the winter. Its pretty simple without abs. 1) Press brake pedal 2) if car starts to fish tail or slide let off the brakes until your tires catch and you regain control 3)repeat. My 2011 Tacoma is the first vehicle out of about 15 with functional abs and I pulled the fuses the 4th day I owned it. I tried to slow down to turn on a street in the snow and the abs kicked on it took me about 200 yards to stop from 30mph. Think about it this way... How can something that literally brakes only half the time stop you any faster. Abs is designed for idiots that have no control over their car and if you ask me, if you NEED abs to drive, then you shouldn't drive at all. (Rant over)
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Old 09-21-2012, 08:16 PM   #13 (permalink)
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My reason for desiring abs is that my mother crashed a '89 Toyota Corolla due to locked brakes while me and my sister were inside (poeple in front of us braked, it was very snowy, hit guard rail, no one was hurt, and we drove home). My mother was no driving enthusiest, but my father I would like to say is, he isn't one to stomp on the brakes. He later drove the car and spun out mutiple times due to locked brakes in the snow(though he began doing it for fun after a certain point). The service shop is likely to blame, the brakes were just fine before they replaced the pads.
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Old 09-21-2012, 08:58 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I have it on my car, both traction control and ABS. Never heard either one actuate, but I have not tried to climb the 14% grade up my driveway on ice or snow so far. When that happens I scrape the driveway and get a running start in the 35 foot deep garage and the additional 8 feet under the front porch.

The few times we have had some serious snow, I get out there immediately with a piece of plywood and become the human snowplow.

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Old 09-21-2012, 10:57 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I think maybe one time in the 19 years I've had my F150 I've had the ABS kick on, excluding the times I purposely stomped on the brakes on a slick ice sheet just to see if the ABS worked. I could certainly take it or leave it- mostly leave it, as it's just another thing to go wrong and require service/repair at some point.
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Old 09-22-2012, 01:57 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BackroadBomber View Post
Think about it this way... How can something that literally brakes only half the time stop you any faster.
Because braking half the time slows you down faster than skidding. You can also steer while braking heavily in a modern car with ABS. Do that in a car with regular brakes and you'll just slide.

Your experience was atypical; it is possible that the system in your truck was broken.


ABS was optional in the Aspire.

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Old 09-22-2012, 10:40 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Air bags are designed to protect you when you are not wearing a seat belt, that is why some cars in the early '90's with automatic seat belts did not have air bags, they are their to save the people who can't figure out that it's a good idea to put a seat belt on!

Every automotive journal that I've read says that Anti-lock brakes increase your stopping distance and take away control from the driver, a lot of automotive magazines give stopping distances and slalom times with and without traction control being turned on and while traction control is more then just ABS breaks, you can see from those times that nearly every car that has an option where you can turn it off you can stop quicker and turn sharper, even more so in older cars.

But they all also seem to agree that ABS is a "good" idea for inexperienced drivers... but I've found that the best thing for inexperienced drivers is to learn to drive and learn how your car feels when it starts to go in to a skid! get experienced and learn to stop quicker then you would have with ABS breaks, learn to control the car instead of assuming that a little computer in their is going to control it better then you.

Some people scoff at the idea, but first slippery day of the season, take your car to an empty parking lot and relearn how to drive on a slippery surface! I've lived my whole life in northern Wisconsin and we get our share of snow, we also tend to get a nice mid winter freezing rain that leaves us with a layer of ice on all the roads for a few weeks.
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Old 09-22-2012, 11:00 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by some_other_dave View Post
Because braking half the time slows you down faster than skidding. You can also steer while braking heavily in a modern car with ABS. Do that in a car with regular brakes and you'll just slide.

Your experience was atypical; it is possible that the system in your truck was broken.


ABS was optional in the Aspire.

-soD
you do know that proper braking technique can be learned for that; it's called threshold braking and steering; i've seen more cops use that then think abs will save your ass.

i bet you i can lock-up the wheels on an abs equip vehicle; in actual fact it's probably what caused me to turn 120 degrees and go into a building in the middle of summer.
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Old 09-23-2012, 02:45 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by some_other_dave View Post
Because braking half the time slows you down faster than skidding. You can also steer while braking heavily in a modern car with ABS. Do that in a car with regular brakes and you'll just slide.

Your experience was atypical; it is possible that the system in your truck was broken.


ABS was optional in the Aspire.

-soD
It's a 2011 Tacoma, it was 4 days old. If the abs system isn't working properly I'm driving it THROUGH the dealership.
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Old 09-23-2012, 01:57 PM   #20 (permalink)
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ABS does increase stopping distance. it's designed to prevent the tires from locking up on the pavement, which will cause all available traction to be used for slowing down the vehicle, rather than ~80% stopping capablility and ~20% turning.

think about it, what has the potential to slow down something faster, a big chunk of rubber scrubbing against asphalt with thousands of pounds of weight on it, or the same chunk of rubber rolling to a stop?

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