Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Aerodynamics
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-08-2008, 04:28 PM   #1 (permalink)
Dartmouth 2010
 
SVOboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hanover, NH
Posts: 6,447

Vegan Powa! - '91 Honda CRX DX
Team Honda
90 day: 66.52 mpg (US)
Thanks: 92
Thanked 122 Times in 90 Posts
Send a message via AIM to SVOboy Send a message via MSN to SVOboy Send a message via Yahoo to SVOboy
Driving in wind vs. calm: which is more efficient and why?

What's more efficient and why: driving a round trip in calm conditions, or driving into a headwind at higher load, then in the tailwind on the return trip?

Thanks for the thoughts,

  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 11-08-2008, 08:01 PM   #2 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
wagonman76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Northwest Lower Michigan
Posts: 1,006

Red Car - '89 Chevrolet Celebrity CL 4 door
Team Chevy
90 day: 36.47 mpg (US)

Winter Wagon - '89 Pontiac 6000 LE Wagon
90 day: 28.26 mpg (US)
Thanks: 8
Thanked 17 Times in 16 Posts
My thoughts are that calm would be better. Because the amount of work to power through the wind goes up exponentially as the speed increases. So the headwind (essentially higher wind speed) would hurt more than the gains youd get from a tailwind (essentially lower wind speed).
__________________

Winter daily driver, parked most days right now


Summer daily driver
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2008, 12:11 AM   #3 (permalink)
Deadly Efficient
 
Tango Charlie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Goshen, Indiana
Posts: 1,234

Olivia - '03 Pontiac Vibe base
90 day: 36.01 mpg (US)

R2-D2 - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 58.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 134
Thanked 176 Times in 91 Posts
IF the gale was strong enough to put your vehicle's engine into an ideal load condition; i.e.-that elusive BSFC map island...
AND you could coast all the way home...
essentially a mega pulse and glide, then yeah, it would be more efficient.

In other words, I think calm conditions would win. Darn fickle Mother Nature...
__________________
-Terry
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2008, 07:57 AM   #4 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
basjoos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Upstate SC
Posts: 1,088

Aerocivic - '92 Honda Civic CX
Last 3: 70.54 mpg (US)

AerocivicLB - '92 Honda Civic CX
Team Honda
90 day: 55.14 mpg (US)

Camryglide - '20 Toyota Camry hybrid LE
90 day: 65.83 mpg (US)
Thanks: 16
Thanked 677 Times in 302 Posts
Calm. Most of the time you're not getting a pure head or tail wind and there is some crosswind component. The more of a crosswind vector you get, the more of a side load you're putting on your tires (the equivalent of light cornering with its increased RR) and vehicles typically have much worse Cd for a wind coming in at an angle than they do for a wind coming from straight ahead (increased aero drag). Then there's the exponential wind velocity factor mentioned above. But even if you drop your ground speed to compensate for the increased airspeed during the headwind portion of your drive and increase your groundspeed while driving in a tailwind, the crosswinds and gusts are still going to increase your RR and aero drag.
__________________
aerocivic.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2008, 12:03 PM   #5 (permalink)
MechE
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 1,151

The Miata - '01 Mazda MX-5 Miata
Thanks: 0
Thanked 22 Times in 18 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tango Charlie View Post
IF the gale was strong enough to put your vehicle's engine into an ideal load condition; i.e.-that elusive BSFC map island...
I'm not convinced that would be beneficial...

BSFC islands show you the best thermally efficient zones - but that doesn't mean it won't consume less fuel.

If riding in a headwind puts you into peak BSFC, you're using the least amount of fuel per HP... But, if you need to make 15hp more to be on that island, that could very well mean you're consuming more fuel, just at a higher thermal efficiency.
__________________
Cars have not created a new problem. They merely made more urgent the necessity to solve existing ones.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2008, 10:17 AM   #6 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: KC
Posts: 62
Thanks: 3
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Doesn't your frontal area increase in a crosswind? The 'front' of your car is relative to the wind vector, not the vehicle's direction down the road.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2008, 04:23 PM   #7 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,527

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 54.46 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car Mirage - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 62.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,078
Thanked 6,976 Times in 3,612 Posts
aspera: yes.

A goes up for sure; Cd probably does too.
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2008, 08:31 PM   #8 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 568
Thanks: 1
Thanked 73 Times in 58 Posts
Disturbed air might come as a tailwind, in which case drag would be lower.

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread






Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com