Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Motorcycles / Scooters
Register Now
 Register Now
 


Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-27-2019, 09:07 PM   #31 (permalink)
JSH
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: PDX
Posts: 578

City Slicker - '16 Chevy Spark EV
90 day: 128.6 mpg (US)

Adventure Seeker - '04 Chevy Astro - Campervan
Last 3: 19.56 mpg (US)

Dieselgate - '14 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI
90 day: 36.83 mpg (US)
Thanks: 14
Thanked 231 Times in 169 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by samwichse View Post
How do any new Mitsubishi Mirages get sold, when you can buy a used Acura TSX for less money?
I don't know that a 19 year old car is a fair comparison.

You can get a 2 year old Leaf with less than 10K miles for the price of the Solo.

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=231370370

  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 03-01-2019, 08:44 AM   #32 (permalink)
Thalmaturge
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: The edge of nowhere
Posts: 764

Go Pod - '00 Honda Insight AC

The Tinyvan - '07 Honda Fit Sport

Spicy Italian - '13 Fiat 500 Abarth
Thanks: 365
Thanked 368 Times in 244 Posts
I mean, it's only a 9 year old car, and a Honda with less than 100k. But it's also a luxury marque in an attempt to show the absurdity of the statement.

So....
You can get a 3 year old Honda Fit with less than 50k for significantly less than the price of a Mirage.
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ckType=listing

Or you can get one that's about 1.5 years old with 36k for about the price of a Mirage:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ckType=listing

It's a larger, more luxurious, better appointed car.

Or how about a Cruze LT with 18k?
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...Type=spotlight

My point was that every new car, especially every new "econo" model has to do battle with a huge, inexpensive used market where the "off the lot" penalty has already been paid. Thems the breaks for this segment.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2019, 11:33 AM   #33 (permalink)
JSH
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: PDX
Posts: 578

City Slicker - '16 Chevy Spark EV
90 day: 128.6 mpg (US)

Adventure Seeker - '04 Chevy Astro - Campervan
Last 3: 19.56 mpg (US)

Dieselgate - '14 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI
90 day: 36.83 mpg (US)
Thanks: 14
Thanked 231 Times in 169 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by samwichse View Post
My point was that every new car, especially every new "econo" model has to do battle with a huge, inexpensive used market where the "off the lot" penalty has already been paid. Thems the breaks for this segment.
True. The same can be said for motorcycles. A BMW R1250RT costs as much as a new Honda Civic. There is no logically reason to buy the motorcycle. People buy a motorcycle priced the same as a car for the experience of riding a motorcycle. It is very different than driving a car.

The problem for the Solo is that it isn't a different form factor. It is a car driving experience, without the safety of a car, from a start-up company, that is likely to be out of business before the warranty ends.

I personally think the Solo would have sold 10 years ago when affordable EVs were rare. People would have overlooked the downside just to own an EV. Today the market is flooded with cheap off-lease EVs with 4-5 years of warranty remaining.

We will see if enough people want to be different for the sake of being different.


EDIT: I also agree that there is no logical reason to buy a Mirage.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2019, 02:34 PM   #34 (permalink)
home of the odd vehicles
 
rmay635703's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere in WI
Posts: 2,951

Silver - '10 Chevy Cobalt XFE
Thanks: 261
Thanked 523 Times in 393 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH View Post
True.

Today the market is flooded with cheap off-lease EVs with 4-5 years of warranty remaining

EDIT: I also agree that there is no logical reason to buy a Mirage.
It’s flooded as you say because used EVs are hard sells in their home markets
AKA Most EVowners want a new EV. Further that many states punitively tax an EV which virtually haults used EV sales in those areas.

Most EVs in Wisconsin were bought used and were originally from primarily 3 states.

The result of all this is a strange situation where a lot of salvage EVs get exported overseas for more money and parts / usedcars become more scarce here.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2019, 05:40 PM   #35 (permalink)
JSH
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: PDX
Posts: 578

City Slicker - '16 Chevy Spark EV
90 day: 128.6 mpg (US)

Adventure Seeker - '04 Chevy Astro - Campervan
Last 3: 19.56 mpg (US)

Dieselgate - '14 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI
90 day: 36.83 mpg (US)
Thanks: 14
Thanked 231 Times in 169 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmay635703 View Post
It’s flooded as you say because used EVs are hard sells in their home markets
AKA Most EVowners want a new EV. Further that many states punitively tax an EV which virtually haults used EV sales in those areas.

Most EVs in Wisconsin were bought used and were originally from primarily 3 states.

The result of all this is a strange situation where a lot of salvage EVs get exported overseas for more money and parts / usedcars become more scarce here.
The market is flooded because most EVs are originally sold on 3 year leases and EV sales are picking up.

I assume the “punitive tax” is the registration fee for EVs. Do people really not by an EV that will save them $1000 on fuel per year because they don’t want to pay the State government a $100 registration fee?
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2019, 10:45 PM   #36 (permalink)
home of the odd vehicles
 
rmay635703's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere in WI
Posts: 2,951

Silver - '10 Chevy Cobalt XFE
Thanks: 261
Thanked 523 Times in 393 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH View Post
The market is flooded because most EVs are originally sold on 3 year leases and EV sales are picking up.

I assume the “punitive tax” is the registration fee for EVs. Do people really not by an EV that will save them $1000 on fuel per year because they don’t want to pay the State government a $100 registration fee?
Yes, Wisconsin EV sales fell to single digit monthly sales after the fee passed.

Other states without EV incentives have had the EV market collapse after adding fees as well.

Can tell me it shouldn’t be that way but that’s how it’s been working by the numbers.

Further my Insight uses about $150-$180 per year of fuel
My Plug in uses $150-$180 a year of “fuel” as well

A $100 annual fee is equal to 40% of my driving expenses
(considering my maintenance 5 years in is nearly zero on both)
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2019, 11:29 PM   #37 (permalink)
JSH
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: PDX
Posts: 578

City Slicker - '16 Chevy Spark EV
90 day: 128.6 mpg (US)

Adventure Seeker - '04 Chevy Astro - Campervan
Last 3: 19.56 mpg (US)

Dieselgate - '14 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI
90 day: 36.83 mpg (US)
Thanks: 14
Thanked 231 Times in 169 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmay635703 View Post
Yes, Wisconsin EV sales fell to single digit monthly sales after the fee passed.

Other states without EV incentives have had the EV market collapse after adding fees as well.

Can tell me it shouldn’t be that way but that’s how it’s been working by the numbers.

Further my Insight uses about $150-$180 per year of fuel
My Plug in uses $150-$180 a year of “fuel” as well

A $100 annual fee is equal to 40% of my driving expenses
(considering my maintenance 5 years in is nearly zero on both)
You seem to drive much less than the average person. The average person drives 13,500 miles per year.

13,500 miles / 30 mpg x $3 per gallon is $1350 per year for gasoline.

13,500 miles / 4.5 miles / kWh x $0.115 per kWh is $345 per year for electricity.

I agree that a flat fee doesn't make sense. We should just replace the gas tax with a mileage fee applied to all vehicles.

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com