Electric Turbocharger/Supercharger?

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

You need the additional power very rarely as a percentage of total operational time.

With a turbodiesel out on the highway will a few pounds of boost all the time, that is at least several horsepower.

[Xist]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

Green Car Congress: Valeo acquires electric supercharger business from Controlled Power

I wouldn't consider it a unicorn topic considering the potential. I understand few here would agree with that opinion. You need the additional power very rarely as a percentage of total operational time.

regards
Mech

Most "electric superchargers" are useless bilge pumps and computer fans. I had thought that the e-Ram would do [B]something[B], but apparently the thing that is done is negligible. I read on here about the Thomas Knight ones, which have as much shared "DNA" as mermaids and manatees.

There are legitimate and proven implementations, but they seem like a tiny fraction, lost in the junk heap of pretenders.

However, I have a question. That article linked to a previous one, introducing the technology:

Compared with a 1.6-liter naturally aspirated engine, the downsized engine with electric supercharger reduces the 70-100 km/h (44-63 mph) top gear acceleration time from 18 to 11 seconds.

Green Car Congress: CPT VTES Electric Supercharger Selected for Two Projects

These cars take 11-18 seconds to accelerate from 44 MPH to 63?

[P-hack]

In top gear only it seems. I'm sure one could downshift and get better times, but it is a controlled measurement of lower rpm performance perhaps.

It seems that a proper one could be used to downsize an engine for more optimal hiway mileage while still getting ok performance. If it doesn't look like a motor bolted to half a turbo then it is probably junk.

I expect that one could do something like part turbo, part electric supercharger, part exhaust driven alternator too.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by DIMS

Not all are Unicorn though

Thomas Knight Turbo Electric Supercharger - Tech Review - Turbo Magazine

A fluff piece mock article but an entertaining read. I really don't know enough about the topic to sit in judgement, but from what I've read that one stands above the rest.

BMW Patent on Elec-Supercharger
BMW Patents Its Electric Turbocharger Technology. More Power, Less Lag. - BMW M3 and BMW M4 Forum

[freebeard]

The BMW patent shows something that should work, but it is intended as a [third?] turbo to supplement others. So it isn't a total solution.

The problem comes in when you are essentially driving the turbo with the alternator. Losses accumulate. What might be feasible would be to use a conventional turbo to drive a generator/alternator to recharge the battery.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by freebeard

What might be feasible would be to use a conventional turbo to drive a generator/alternator to recharge the battery.

That's roughly similar to how modern jet engines fitted to airliners get their generators driven.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by freebeard

The BMW patent shows something that should work, but it is intended as a [third?] turbo to supplement others. So it isn't a total solution.

The problem comes in when you are essentially driving the turbo with the alternator. Losses accumulate. What might be feasible would be to use a conventional turbo to drive a generator/alternator to recharge the battery.

That's why you have the turbine and compressor and motor all on the same shaft. The motor accelerates the turbo so there's no lag, and when the turbine is spinning at high speed it is more efficient and can be entirely exhaust powered.

Instead of using a wastegate on a smaller turbine to build boost at low rpm, you use a big turbine and slow it down to optimal speed using the motor as a generator. At very low speed, the turbine might need help from the electric motor, but that's not a big deal as the compressor power requirements are also lower. At high speed is when the power requirement is high and you want to tap into the exhaust to avoid the need for massive electrical power draw.

It's simple and seemingly compromised but actually works pretty well.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Considering that Volvo already uses an air-assisted system called PowerPulse to make the turbocharging setup spool faster on its Diesel cars, relying on an electric compressor and a storage tank to supply air to the turbine during starts or when faster acceleration is required, and that its working principle quite resembles the way an APU fitted to an airliner supplies air to start the engine #1, eventually an all-electric starter-generator to be connected to a turbocharger doesn't sound too unlikely at all.

[sendler]

We had another thread on this.
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http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...r-33630-4.html
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F1 cars are hybrids and it has become a fuel economy competition. They use a motor/ generator on the crank and another on the turbo that can alternately harvest energy from the exhaust and act as the variation to control boost pressure. Or provide supercharging boost until the exhaust flow comes back up during first acceleration.
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https://youtu.be/HDtMehBCpl4
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[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Since many technologies such as VVT were developed on Formula 1 before they reached the mainstream cars, it sounds quite promising.