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Old 04-29-2014, 11:54 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Hi from Colorful Colorado

Hey there, I'm brand new on this forum and to hypermiling but loving it so far.
I drive a '08 Toyota Yaris 4 door sedan with a 5sp. manual transmission. My daily commute takes me 35 miles one way from the mountain to the city to work. My car gets really good mileage already, about 40 in the winter and as high as 45 in the summer. My goal is to consistently get in the +50mpg range by using hypermiling techniques and simple modifications and with advice from you experienced folks.
So currently my road is under construction near my house, and to get to the highway I have to go uphill for a mile, but once on the Highway I have a 4 mile downhill run. The last two days I've coasted it engine off EOC, which is pretty fun but I pick up a lot of speed and must use engine braking with the transmission either in 5th or 4th gear to stay in control. Then near the bottom I coast in neutral as far as I can before starting the engine again. Okay so while the engine is off, the odometer is not recording miles. Any suggestions? Does the ScanGuage work when the key is off? Secondly, am I damaging my transmission by coasting in gear with the engine off when it is cold? It doesn't seem like it.
I guess I could simply add 5 EOC miles per day to the total miles driven when I calculate my MPG at my next fill-up.
Anyway, thanks for having me. It's great to be here.

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Old 04-30-2014, 09:28 AM   #2 (permalink)
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"Does the ScanGuage work when the key is off?"

I've only performed EOC a handful of times and my SG turned off after about 5 seconds, which is what it normally does when I park and shut down. My assumption is it can't record distance since it reads from the ECU and if the electrical is shut down, then so is the ECU, thus no data from the EOC period. I will say I am not certain on this, perhaps there's a short period after shutoff where the ECU continues to register data, but I doubt it.

"Secondly, am I damaging my transmission by coasting in gear with the engine off when it is cold? It doesn't seem like it."

I'm no transmission expert, by any stretch. However I recently had to replace the valve body on my VW 01M transmission and have researched my transmission extensively, so I have a basic understanding of how mine works, which may vary greatly from yours.

In general, I have not employed EOC because I was concerned about damaging the transmission during long coasts (minutes at times) by not having the added benefit of fluid pumping as efficiently as with the engine on. I monitor my tranny fluid temp with my SG and know that even coasting in neutral with the engine on creates a temporary bump in TFT by 2 to 5 degrees. As a rebuilt/new transmission repair is expensive, I don't take the chance of the TFT rising even higher by going EOC. Perhaps I'm overly-cautious, but I know that sustained high TFT can do significant harm.

That said, there are plenty of hypermilers employing EOC daily with high-mileage vehicles with no apparent adverse effects. My guess is it probably has more to do with specific transmission tolerances, the amount of time during EOC periods and driving conditions' effect on higher TFTs. (Going EOC during winter months probably produces lower TFT increases than doing so in sweltering heat.)

I look forward to reading others' differing opinions. Welcome to the forums! (I'm a Noob, too!)
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Old 04-30-2014, 10:08 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Welcome...

Quote:
Okay so while the engine is off, the odometer is not recording miles. Any suggestions?
Sounds like your using the key to stop and start the engine. You need to add a injector kill switch to turn off the engine without killing power to the other systems. (dash, ScanGuage, turn signals, radio etc. etc.)

To restart, either use the key or bump start. It would however be better to add a remote start button and save the wear and tear on the ignition switch.

Quote:
Secondly, am I damaging my transmission by coasting in gear with the engine off when it is cold?
Short answer. "no".

Longer answer. It's "possible". Some manual transmission lack proper oiling
when being towed in neutral, therefore also coasting. You could search the net and see if any of the motorhome people have reported any problems, since they drag their cars everywhere they go.

Temperature of the oil would have little or no effect.


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Old 04-30-2014, 11:26 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Welcome to the site!

When you key off to EOC, you need to turn the key back to 'run' so it powers all the other bits of your car like airbags and odometer. This also prevents the steering wheel from locking when turned!

If you're coasting downhill and its in gear, you'll engage DFCO (deceleration fuel cutoff), and you should see 9999 on the scangauge. At this point you aren't using any fuel. This is perfectly fine, and it won't damage your transmission.

If you set your 'fuel type' on the scangauge to 'hybrid' it will stay on with the engine off.
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Old 04-30-2014, 11:26 AM   #5 (permalink)
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You could also turn the key forward towards the start position after shutting the engine off. It should allow the system to power up.

It would be best however to add the injector kill switch and remote start button.

Using the key switch could lead to a unpleasant experience should the steering wheel lock.

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Old 04-30-2014, 11:30 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
When you key off to EOC, you need to turn the key back to 'run' so it powers all the other bits of your car like airbags and odometer.
Hah....

Posted at the same time... 10:26 am

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Old 05-01-2014, 11:16 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Thanks guys. Today i got a SG2. Now i can really tell what I'm doing.
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Old 05-04-2014, 07:55 PM   #8 (permalink)
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The White Gnat's manual odometer will keep "rolling" with the key off, but when I was driving the Jimmy, it's odometer (fully digital, apparently) would stop recording. So I would do the trick of turning the key back on right after the engine died. But this probably caused my lights to flash, etc, so I didn't like to do it at night, especially.

I'm now starting to experience trouble with my starter switch on the Gnat, so probably the fuel injector kill switch AND a start button will be the "ticket". Gotta get on that before I find myself unable to turn the starter in the middle of the night somewhere!!!
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Old 05-05-2014, 11:20 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I put the SG in Hybrid mode like Daox suggested and now if I EOC with the key "on" the scan gauge stays on, so does the ODO.

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