how about a fuel heater?

[mwebb]

Originally Posted by Nerys

mwebb you say its a bad idea but Fail to actually tell us WHY its a bad idea.

Care to clarify? I have no doubt your right but for me and likely others such is not good enough. I wish to know WHY its a bad idea.

heating the air has been experimented with a whole lot in the pages of this forum

so you can read up on the success or lack thereof of current and past experimentation regarding WAI

you can learn from the pain of others , if you have your wits about you
and you can make your own informed choice

those who will not learn from the mistakes of history
are doomed to repeat them

[olmon]

Heated & vaporized fuel was the principle behind the 'miracle' carbs that would give you 100mpg+ on an American V8 in the 60s. They did work, however, after a few thousand miles, the valves were gone. So much for saving money. There have been several forays in that area over the years, but no real news. Smokey Yunick, of racing fame, modified a Pontiac Fiero with the 4-tech, called it a 'heat' engine. I only saw one article on it where he claimed much increased efficiency along with greatly increased power (to the point that he had to beef up the drive axles to handle it). Apparently he got bought out by the oil companies because that one article was all I ever saw and have never been able to find any more information or eve nreferences to it.
Also, in the 70s, Pratt & Whitney developed an engine for the military, a twin rotor, stratified charge, turbo-charged, multi fuel rotary engine that produced approx 700 hp on pump gas and (in a 2ton truck crusing @ 60mph) gave 35mpg. Another thing that you won't find any reference to. It was classified, I just happened to see the R&D papers on it @ the shop I was working in at the time.
In 1974, a hydrostatic drive system was patented by a man in Portland that, powered by an 18hp lawn tractor engine, gave 75 mpg @ 60mph. A modern version of that system, using a free-piston 2cyl diesel to pump, with regenerative braking, gives 0-60 @-5 sec and 130+mpg in a 5 passenger vehicle in the Honda Accord size range. There is a good website describing this auto & its' drive system. Look up Valentin Technologies & XPrize cars.

[mwebb]

..."A modern version of that system, using a free-piston 2cyl diesel to pump, with regenerative braking, gives 0-60 @-5 sec and 130+mpg in a 5 passenger vehicle in the Honda Accord size range. There is a good website describing this auto & its' drive system. Look up Valentin Technologies & XPrize cars."....

key word is allegedly ...

this particular
hoax
begins in 2007 , and the world is so impressed that no one has (yet) put up the 3.8 million dollars that would (allegedly) be used to manufacture the
FIRST and ONLY
functional prototype ....

the only thing that is lacking is
credibility

[verndawg23]

There are actually many patents on the idea of fuel pre-heaters for fuel injection. The heated fuel expands as it enters the combustion chamber, it burns more efficiently and the injector timing gets adjusted. The first time I came across this idea was a guy who couldn't understand why he got great mileage from the bottom half of his fuel tank. It turned out the fuel pump was overheating. The full tank could absorb the extra heat without any change. As the fuel level dropped it would become increasingly warmer and fuel mileage went up. I'm hoping to try it out soon.

[Nerys]

You made the same reply so I must therefore make the same reply to your reply

mwebb you say its a bad idea but Fail to actually tell us WHY its a bad idea.

Care to clarify? I have no doubt your right but for me and likely others such is not good enough. I wish to know WHY its a bad idea.

[chuckm]

What's wrong? Lets walk through the process.
How fast does your themostatically controlled heater react? How big a heat reservoir does it have, including the surrounding metal? You take your foot off the gas, coasting down to a stop light. Your engine goes into DFCO. Fuel stagnates in the line and vaporizes. Seeing that a given volume of liquid expands TREMENDOUSLY in becoming a gas, fuel line pressure sky rockets and pushes fuel through the injector. DFCO no more. Additionally, if pre-vaporized fuel gets to the injector, you're likely to have a very bad detonation.

[Nerys]

well no DFCO in my car and second HOW HOT are you making the fuel?

Never did a fuel heater. Probably too lazy to get around to it but still I hate when people say "Bad idea" and then proceed to tell you NOTHING about why its a bad idea.

MY idea of a fuel heater is to run a COIL of fuel line say 5 feet of line in a coil into a sealed tank. Through this tank would run COOLANT from your car's radiator.

so what 150'-200'

thats enough to make gasoline crazy dangerous? its self regulating by your cars own cooling system. No direct electricity of heating element ever comes into contacts with your fuel or fuel line. Your using your own radiator coolant as a transfer medium.

[chuckm]

There are numerous hydrocarbons in gasoline. Toluene makes up as much as 35% and boils at 230º. Benzene, up to 5% by volume, boils at 176º. MTBE, up to 18% by volume (or 10% in some states), boils at 131º. The MTBE replacement, ETBE, boils at 160º. Everyone's favorite, ethanol, boils at 173º. Tertiary-amyl methyl ether, up to 17%, boils at 186º. n-Hexane boils at 156º. (All temperatures listed are in Fahrenheit.) The MSDS on gasoline I found shows a boiling range of 85 - 437º.

HOW HOT are you going to get? Are you going to control the available heat?

so what 150'-200'

thats enough to make gasoline crazy dangerous?

With a homemade system? Yes! I wouldn't want to be in the car. Yes, the x-prize team Fuel Vapor Technologies seems to have a working system. But, hey, feel free to try it on your own. Darwin has a way of demonstrating what works and what doesn't.

[bandit86]

how would heated gas take the valves out?
Mixture can be adjusted if it runs rich
no worry about a vapour lock with fuel injection.

[mwebb]

..."There are actually many patents on the idea of fuel pre-heaters for fuel injection. The heated fuel expands as it enters the combustion chamber, it burns more efficiently and the injector timing gets adjusted."...

there is no need for something to actually function
AS CLAIMED IN THE PATENT
just because it has a patent

their are many "fuel line magnets " which have patents
which do not perform as claimed in the patent documentation

and are as useless as mudflaps on a sledgehammer