How to improve Dodge Ram Van from 12mpg? [Belly pans?]

[Grim]

Originally Posted by ahanix1989

Wow, just woke up and already tons of great information! I'll have to tackle these one at a time...

@rmay635703:

It's been running Mobil-1 Truck/SUV oil for a while, but a lot of people are suggesting I switch to Valvoline, which I plan on soon. I've done some little things just to make the engine breathe better (Dynomax exhaust, modified the intake manifold, 180° t-stat)

Flag on the play!

The fuel injection may be staying in "open loop" longer then it should.
Put that back to stock rated.

I'm mostly a GM and Toyota guy. On GM's swapping a 180 thermostat for a 195 almost always reduces the economy and makes drive-ability issues such as fowled plugs and plugged cats and causes CEL lights for o2 sensors. In the GM forums the post usualy start with " I failed my smog test. High HC reading.

On Toyota's they have a "jiggle valve" that allows for a small amount of bypass to preheat the radiator to prevent temp bounce as well as equalizing pressure so that the flow off the pump doesn't hold it closed. It also aids in bleeding air. 1/8 inch hole in the lip of the thermostat is a common shadtree trick to do the same.

Impressive gains with the changes you did.

[Jethro]

^^ Agreed. Even though it's a PITA, swap a 195 back in there. I used to be a 180 person "gives more power" The hell it does! Truck is MUCH happier with a 195.

(00 Ram 5.9 Magnum, FYI) Found this on my buddies Dakota (5.2) as well as my Dad's 5.9. Turns out most stock specs are that way for a reason. Weird...

[ahanix1989]

You guys are probably right.... once the thermostat opens it has a tendency to drop pretty low for up to ten minutes. If it's below 10°F out it can spend the entire drive just barely above the lowest 1/3-mark.... rather than halfway between 1/3 and C when normal.

Is there any way to determine when my engine is in "open loop" mode? Is there a certain trigger I can tap into?

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by ahanix1989

Is there any way to determine when my engine is in "open loop" mode? Is there a certain trigger I can tap into?

A scanguage or OBDII reader can determine this. As for doing it yourself, best to just get an MPGguino assembled, they don't cost much and work well. It takes a computer to really determine what your OBDII is doing real time, can't really watch voltages.

Also on Dodge Open Loop is sometimes better than closed when the motor is cold, my truck is affected by temperatures dramatically, when cold my MPGs are 50% of when warm and when warm but not quite up to temp my FE floats about 25% lower than fully heated.

[ahanix1989]

Bah, I want a nice clean look, MPGguino doesn't fit that... hobby boxes aren't my thing. I'd rather just buy a Scangauge in that situation.

I don't know the specific temperature ranges.
This is where my needle is on a 32°F day with the heater on.
It sits a little lower when it's 10°F or below

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by ahanix1989

Bah, I want a nice clean look, MPGguino doesn't fit that... hobby boxes aren't my thing. I'd rather just buy a Scangauge in that situation.

I don't know the specific temperature ranges.
This is where my needle is on a 32°F day with the heater on.
It sits a little lower when it's 10°F or below

As you know that doesn't mean much, The thermostats relative position from day to day is most important, if its lower on cold days you are likely running cold.

Also I think you need an altitude adjustment, the MPGguino is just a tool. Just as you don't drive around with a wrench holding your hood up or a oil pail stuck under the motor you also don't need to have the MPGguino continously mounted, you use it to learn and then put it away when not learning, it does afterall REMOVE in under a minute and is easily stowed anywhere you like. And obviously like a hammer you can use it to do many things or choose not to use it at all if you are ashamed of having it show.

Also you can build a nice purdy case for it if thats your flavor and the guino can come fully assembled ready to go as well.

All this said, I use a scanguage on mine continously and the way I have it mounted isn't pretty but practical since I move it between multple cars. Its up to you how professional the mounting and location is or set it up so it can be removed easily.

If you do find yourself buying a scanguage, remember, get it on ebay or from JCWhitney using one of their 20% off orders over $100 with free shipping. Don't pay too much and remember a scanguage 1 does most everything the 2 will do at a much better price

Cheers
Ryan

[ahanix1989]

Oh really? Didn't even know they still sold ScanGauge I's. What "features" did the II add that may justify the price, if anyone happens to know?

I think I'll get a ScanGauge soon... but I'm still having trouble figuring out that thing with the throttle you mentioned earlier. Also, have you looked into adjusting the TV cable for earlier, softer shifts?

[jmf]

closed-loop monitor
I built one of these for my vx. You can change it to light for closed or open loop. I should try one on my van and see if it helps. I have a extended 15 passenger dodge 3500 with the 5.9L. The best thing for fuel economy is to park it.

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by ahanix1989

Oh really? Didn't even know they still sold ScanGauge I's. What "features" did the II add that may justify the price, if anyone happens to know?

No they don't sell them but they do show up for about $50 or less on ebay every couple of months.

Differences, Xguage & Fuel Cutoff detection I believe, along with being able to save a bunch of trips fuel economy info

The wiggle the fuel pedal thing is only going to have meaning if you have a scanguage and see what effect it has. For me it works best when the motor is cold, I rapidly wiggle it in and out 3 to 4 times a VERY Very small amount from idle then slide in to take off (my rpms only jump to maybe 1-1.2k while wiggling). My paticular truck takes off harder if I do this with less pedal, I am beginning to think it has something to do with my transmission as it likes to stay rather solidly stuck at low speeds for some reason. I also have found I can take off harder as compared to just sliding the pedal in around 20-30mph if I do that trick as well.

Cheers
Ryan

[Frank Lee]

Originally Posted by MetroMPG

I read that type of claim a lot (particularly by owners of thirsty vehicles who don't have fuel economy instrumentation), and it never fails to irk me. I'm very glad you've proven yourself wrong!

It can be sort of true though. You know I know how to drive eco and have for a long time. The F250 460V8 5sp pretty much delivered the same fe no matter what- empty, laden, headwind, tailwind. I think such vehicles normally tap into very little of their power and as such the throttle position doesn't have to change much for varying conditions, unlike our little low powered stuff.