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Old 10-09-2019, 11:53 AM   #61 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Shaneajanderson View Post
That would be an interesting comparison. Why would you expect the cooling system to be heavier? Do new engines generate more heat, or do they just overdo it? I would also expect electric fans to be much lighter than the old belt-driven clutch fan that I have.
I have no evidence, but if the cooling systems are in fact heavier, I think it would be due to the higher power output of the engines.

The 1994 F150 5.0 had a factory output of 195 HP. The 5.0 of a 2019 F150 is 395 HP. If the engine is 40% efficient, then would you have 60% of the energy escaping as wasted heat? If so, the cooling system would need to sized appropriately to dissipate that heat.

Another thing to look at is the capability of today's truck vs the capability of a truck from 1994. The truck made today can haul and tow a significantly higher amount of weight. Google says the F150 of today can tow more than the F250 Super Duty from 1994.

For that, they probably need to beef up a lot of other components. Some of the weight is obviously offset by the use of higher strength steel and other lighter weight materials.

Shaneajanderson, I also think a lot of the added weight is from government regulations (environmental and safety).

I do know that the options on todays trucks can add over 1000 lbs to the weight of the truck when comparing a base truck to a fully loaded truck. The panoramic sun roof adds close to 200 lbs on the F150, and so do the automatically deploying running boards. You can get massaging seats, power inverters, 22" wheels, etc. It all adds up.

A standard GVWR of 7050# on a modern F150 may have a payload capacity of 1300# or 2500#....depending on the creature comforts and configuration selected (base model vs Platinum model).

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Old 10-09-2019, 12:48 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingofwylietx View Post
I have no evidence, but if the cooling systems are in fact heavier, I think it would be due to the higher power output of the engines.

The 1994 F150 5.0 had a factory output of 195 HP. The 5.0 of a 2019 F150 is 395 HP. If the engine is 40% efficient, then would you have 60% of the energy escaping as wasted heat? If so, the cooling system would need to sized appropriately to dissipate that heat.

Another thing to look at is the capability of today's truck vs the capability of a truck from 1994. The truck made today can haul and tow a significantly higher amount of weight. Google says the F150 of today can tow more than the F250 Super Duty from 1994.

For that, they probably need to beef up a lot of other components. Some of the weight is obviously offset by the use of higher strength steel and other lighter weight materials.

Shaneajanderson, I also think a lot of the added weight is from government regulations (environmental and safety).

I do know that the options on todays trucks can add over 1000 lbs to the weight of the truck when comparing a base truck to a fully loaded truck. The panoramic sun roof adds close to 200 lbs on the F150, and so do the automatically deploying running boards. You can get massaging seats, power inverters, 22" wheels, etc. It all adds up.

A standard GVWR of 7050# on a modern F150 may have a payload capacity of 1300# or 2500#....depending on the creature comforts and configuration selected (base model vs Platinum model).
I can't contest that all those features add weight, however I looked at some figures and a base model with the 3.3 V6, regular cab, short bed, 2WD only weighs about 150 lbs less than my supercab shortbed, 4wd with a v8.

Good points on extra cooling weight due to extra power, however as far as payload capacity goes, they used to way underrate pickups for some reason, according to my GVWR the maximum trailer weight I can pull is about 2500, but I have pulled 6-7k trailers quite often with no problem at all, just slowed down a bit for my own sake, but the rig would have had no problem getting up to 70mph on the flats if I had wanted to. I also have a 302 which is about the worst engine option for this generation for pulling.
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Old 10-09-2019, 01:29 PM   #63 (permalink)
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It seems like most of us prefer smaller, lighter, and more nimble vehicles. Hopefully there will always be Fits and Yariiiiiii. In another five or ten years I may be able to afford one!
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Old 10-09-2019, 01:35 PM   #64 (permalink)
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I like to mix it up. Normally the Acura is the fun(ner) choice, but jumping in the truck after a couple months of that is fun.
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Old 10-09-2019, 02:32 PM   #65 (permalink)
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I'm a car guy, I'd rather drive a car most days. The pickup for me is a tool, much like a hammer, a saw, or a welder. Something that if cared for and maintained will give you years of good service, but at the same time you aren't too worried about nicks or scratches.

That said, I much prefer RWD cars to FWD, if only they made efficient ones
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Old 10-09-2019, 03:36 PM   #66 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaneajanderson
Why would you expect the cooling system to be heavier?
Because they use water? 'A pint's a pound the world around.'

When everything gets heavier you need heavier brakes. And that's rotating mass.
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Old 10-09-2019, 04:35 PM   #67 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingofwylietx View Post
The spirit of my entire post went right over your head.
I don't think it did. You can strap a rocket to a barge, and it's still a barge. Lots of people get excited about a barge that has a big rocket strapped to it, but I'm not one of them. So here's a Grand Cherokee SRT, or maybe it's a Syclone:



Whichever one it is, it's either a crappy Jeep or a crappy pickup truck. Fast, yes, but...
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Transmission type Efficiency
Manual neutral engine off.100% @MPG <----- Fun Fact.
Manual 1:1 gear ratio .......98%
CVT belt ............................88%
Automatic .........................86%

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Old 10-09-2019, 05:10 PM   #68 (permalink)
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....Lots of people get excited about a barge that has a big rocket strapped to it......
Barges have their place and purpose, at least they make them more fun to drive now. Don't be an anti-bargite.

It is a good thing to have so many options in transportation.
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Old 10-09-2019, 05:23 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebeard View Post
Because they use water? 'A pint's a pound the world around.'

When everything gets heavier you need heavier brakes. And that's rotating mass.
My original question was inquiring as to why the newer vehicles would have a higher capacity (and thereby heavier) cooling system. The answer was given that newer vehicles produce more power, and it's logical to assume that they therefore produce more heat and would need more cooling capacity.

Sorry if I nerded out a little on the explanation there, but that's the gist of the conversation.
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Old 10-09-2019, 06:42 PM   #70 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Fat Charlie View Post
You can strap a rocket to a barge, and it's still a barge.
Three hundred years ago, King George I, of England, strapped on George Frideric Handel's Water Music, with full accompanying orchestra, to a barge....... & barged up & down the Thames River. The Royal toot (w/repeats), gave him the limelight & helped him politically.
https://www.npr.org/sections/decepti...sh-of-politics

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