Mirror delete, backup camera and monitor thread - Fuel Economy, Hypermiling, EcoModding News and Forum

skyking · 10-30-2011, 01:49 PM

I started this thread to look at alternatives to augment my rear view on the travel trailer design. I hope it can be used to showcase any new products or ideas regarding backup cameras, standalone monitors, mirror monitors, switching, DVD monitors like I have, etc.
If you have good ideas or questions about any camera/monitor/alternative mirror, post them here.
I realize many threads exist about this, but the tech moves on. Old links are broken, especially Ebay links.

First:
I want a standard centered backup cam on the trailer, and two side cameras. I only need to view one side cam and the backup cam during backing operations.
I can hang or pivot down the monitor in front of the current rear view mirror when towing, the inside mirror is not used with the trailer on.
Any monitor and switching suggestions? Wireless possibilities?

Ladogaboy · 10-30-2011, 03:22 PM

I was considering the idea of fabricating a custom bezel cover that would allow me to install two backup cameras focusing on the driver and passenger side areas that the side view mirrors would normally cover. I could then delete my side view mirrors completely. The only problem is, I think this set up would be illegal under current vehicle codes in my state.

orbywan · 10-30-2011, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skyking

I started this thread to look at alternatives augment my rear view on the travel trailer design. I hope it can be used to showcase any new products or ideas regarding backup cameras, standalone monitors, mirror monitors, switching, DVD monitors like I have, etc.
If you have good ideas or questions about any camera/monitor/alternative mirror, post them here.
I realize many threads exist about this, but the tech moves on. Old links are broken, especially Ebay links.

First:
I want a standard centered backup cam on the trailer, and two side cameras. I only need to view one side cam and the backup cam during backing operations.
I can hang or pivot down the monitor in front of the current rear view mirror when towing, the inside mirror is not used with the trailer on.
Any monitor and switching suggestions? Wireless possibilities?

So this is for your 96 Dodge Ram truck and fifth wheel right? Can you post a photo or two of your dash area? The hard part is finding the right place for the monitor.

I have several suggestions. First of all, to be open about it, I own a company that specializes in exactly what you're talking about - mobile video systems. The name of my company is Total Vision® Products. You can see some of our systems at www.totalvisionproducts.com. To let you know in advance, the systems I'm going to tell you about are mostly not on there. I hired someone to update the site because it is woefully behind where we are at the present, and they all but destroyed the whole thing for lack of knowing what they were doing. It's taken two months to put it back together and half the links still don't work right. Not enough hours in a day.

Anyway, what I would use for that application is a 7 inch quad monitor, if there is room to mount it somewhere. This type of monitor has a four input switcher built into it, and does a quad view of all four cameras, full screen of all four cameras and two sets of split screens. You said you want to see the back up camera and the right side camera as you back up, no problem, that's the most cost efficient and best way to do that. You plug the back up into port 1 and the right side on port 2, and you have them side by side on the split screen when you back up.

The disadvantage to that is you'll have to forgo the usual auto-reverse-default. What that means is that ordinarily when you put the vehicle in reverse, if you hook up the appropriate trigger wire to your back up light circuit, when you put it in reverse, it auto-defaults, full screen, to the back up camera.

I'm sorry Skyking, the timing for this is horrible, I'm going like a madman trying to get out the door to go to the SEMA convention in Vegas. The problem is I'm not at my shop and don't have access to pricing, but I can give you some educated guesstimates. The quad monitors run about $229, the back up camera about $129, the side cameras about $139 each, the trailer connector about $20, and about $75-$100 worth of cables.

You can also go on line and find all these items yourself, what we sell is the best or very close to it. We spend a lot of dollars and time buying and testing things and throw a lot of stuff out because it's crap or so-so. I have overhead and have to pay the bills so our stuff is not the cheapest, but it does come with 15+ years of experience and a guarantee you can count on.

Whether you buy something from us or not, I'm glad to give advice on systems so get a photo of the dash if you can and let me know if we can help. On the way to SEMA, should be interesting.

skyking · 10-30-2011, 07:35 PM

Thank you very much!
To be clear, I would need both side cams installed but never need to see all three cams at once. I would rather have the biggest split screen and chose between left or right side cams as needed.
When backing the far side is blind, the near side is totally covered by the mirror.

NeilBlanchard · 10-30-2011, 11:37 PM

My video mirrors are about 3 years old, and the main challenge I have had is the camera longevity and the monitors dealing with heat. I now have LED backlit 7" monitors and they are much better than the first set which ran hot, and they get dimmer and dimmer as they heated up. The glare and loss of contrast in direct sunlight and the heat made them very hard to use.

The other issue is having a camera lens that is *too* wide angle. This adds a lot of barrel distortion and shrinks objects, so they look farther away than they are. I can deal with a camera with 100-120 degrees of view, but more than that is a problem, and less would be great, but you probably cannot find one with say 90 degrees or less. Having the camera be 4:3 image with the 16:10 screens actually helps "re-expand" the horizontal size of other vehicles.

Wiring needs to be robust. The cameras I have used all have power wires that are concentric rather than paired wires, so pinching them can cause a short. I had this blow the clutch cutoff switch fuse, so I could not start my car... So routing of wires is important, and relieving stress when the wires are bent (say at the door) is also important to consider.

Low and Mean · 10-31-2011, 12:51 AM

What kinda MPG increase when removing the mirrors?
LM

skyking · 10-31-2011, 01:02 AM

I won't be removing my mirrors, but others may. I can fold mine in, and mount a small mirror on the edge when I'm not towing. I'd guess it would be a small change, maybe 2%~3%. Hard to see in the short run.

NeilBlanchard · 10-31-2011, 10:28 AM

It has been a while, but I think that removing side mirrors and replacing them with the small airfoil stalks as I have reduces drag by 8-10% (both by reducing the frontal area and by lowering the Cd), and so the FE increased by about 2-3% -- I agree with skyking that this is a good guesstimate.

skyking · 10-31-2011, 11:07 AM

In the case of your box van, the drag removed vs. total drag would be negligible. Those percentages were for cars, where the frontal area change is more significant.

slowmover · 10-31-2011, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skyking

I won't be removing my mirrors, but others may. I can fold mine in, and mount a small mirror on the edge when I'm not towing. I'd guess it would be a small change, maybe 2%~3%. Hard to see in the short run.

Having additional high-quality visual information of what is happening around the rig seems valuable enough. A TPMS is good, but nothing beats a pair of Mark I eyeballs for detecting all sorts of potential problems, moving or parked.

The alternative "solution" is mirrors large enough and of sufficient quantity to match what video could do.

Configuration testing, wind anomalies, all sorts of stuff comes to mind in understanding hitched rig performance.