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Old 11-25-2012, 10:25 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Thanks for the discussion and the video of the high side crash. This confirms what I have been seeing in other YouTube videos-the bikes tumble after the rider lets go of the bars. The air bag suits will continue to be developed for the race track. For street riding we start by using honeycomb aluminum for aero bodies instead of coroplast. The combination of a crush zone fairing, air bag, and inertial reel lap belt will help when hitting objects such as trees, large deer, and the sides of cars. A healthy attitude is the best way to avoid a crash. There are many car operators that would be better off taking the bus or riding a motorized bicycle instead of a 3500 lb vehicle. New York state is now revoking a driver's license for life if there are repeat DWI convictions.

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Old 11-25-2012, 11:04 PM   #32 (permalink)
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You don't think the bike will tumble with the rider still strapped in?
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:41 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Not near as much because of the greater moment of inertia and greater degree of control. Lots of modeling work would need to be done.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:32 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grant-53 View Post
Not near as much because of the greater moment of inertia
True. It would probably only barrel roll and flip end over end twice instead of five times.
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:24 PM   #35 (permalink)
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It would depend on initial speed. The goal is to design a structure inside the fairing that would give roll over protection. The first attempt would be to use honeycomb aluminum panels to form a bulkhead and skin behind the rider and a reinforced cowl. The bulkhead would reach from the top of the headrest to the bottom of the frame. The cowl hoop or cone would be shoulder height topped by a Lexan windscreen. The inertial reel lap belt would allow the rider to move enough to kneedrag. No vehicle will be as safe as sitting on the couch eating popcorn watching the races on TV but this could offer protection similar to an SCCA spec antique sports car.
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Old 11-27-2012, 03:53 PM   #36 (permalink)
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I think I am going to work towards a front electric/ rear motorcycle drive hybrid trike ala Aptera for my winter vehicle. The bike will get a Vetter style streamlined body but no roll bar or seat belt.
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Old 11-27-2012, 06:25 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Hi Scott, that's an interesting position. I like your idea, but why not have a seat belt? Do you recognise the relative probability of accident types - surely a head-on collision is the most likely type, and then why not protect yourself with a restraint?
Although I don't agree with your concerns about rollover protection, I do recognise your reservations - but then a trike reduces rollover probability substantially, so why not consider a seatbelt?
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:34 PM   #38 (permalink)
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I've considered a tadpole trike over the years but other projects and the family size have put it on the back burner. I know of one person who built a Ridley Trike with the VW torsion bar front end. You will likely have a bulkhead to attach the motorcycle section and it would be easy to make it strong enough to sustain a roll over. Use 3/4" plywood sandwiched between honeycomb aluminum panels. The tub and floor pan could be made from the aluminum panels. I got mine from Testori Interiors Inc. They are now located in Champlain, NY. They also build the subfloor pans for rail cars from plywood and sheet stainless steel. Keith Noakes has some good books on composite construction of race cars, the cut and fold methods are used for the tubs or monocoque chassis. When NY state and Australia mandated seat belt use both saw a 20% reduction in fatalities and injuries. Its cheap insurance.
It might be easier to use the electric motor in the rear drive as 1st gear and reverse. Putting the electric motors on the steering wheels would require some speed controls that allow for the different turning radii. I do understand the desire for all wheel drive in the winter around Syracuse, my in-laws live in the Buffalo south towns. They have big self propelled snow blowers.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:34 AM   #39 (permalink)
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The bulkhead behind the rider including the head rest can take the place of a roll bar if it is sufficiently strong enough. The question is how strong does it need to be? The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety recommends that roof strenght be 4 times the static weight of the vehicle to be a top safety pick. So a 350 lb bike with a 250 lb rider weights a total of 600lbs and the bulkhead needs to support 2400 lbs. I want to bond some 0.350" aluminum honey comb panels to a 3/4" plywood core and see if will support my car ( '95 Geo Prism/ Toyota Corolla).
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Old 01-01-2013, 08:50 PM   #40 (permalink)
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I tested a piece of plywood 3/4 x 12 x 7 by jacking up the front wheel of the Prism and putting the weight of the car on the wood instead of the jack. No splitting or buckling occurred.

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