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Old 11-17-2008, 12:27 PM   #11 (permalink)
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basslover911 -

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BTW, for your air/fuel thing, do you still need to add a separate wideband oxygen sensor or does it simply tap into the exisiting one?
The eagle-research gizmo is designed for narrow-band (0 to 1 volt). I *think* it can be modified to work with wide-band (0 to 5 volt), but I don't remember the website where I read this.

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Old 11-17-2008, 12:46 PM   #12 (permalink)
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tasdrouille -

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You would probably only need one EFIE on the first sensor and just an extender for the second.
I think you mean using one EFIE gizmo to return information to the ECU/PCM. If yes, then based on my observation of the data, I tend to disagree. When I datalog a stock 02 sensor configuration, I can *see* that the second 02 sensor is reporting different oxygen levels after the cat. This makes sense (to me) because there has been a chemical reaction in the cat that has consumed some of the oxygen (right?!?!?!). I know that the oxygen atoms are still there, but I think that when they are combined to make different (non-harmful emission?) molecules, the 02 sensor doesn't see it. Hrrrrmmmm, maybe that's why they call it an 02 sensor, because it only "sees" the 02 molecule. That never occurred to me.

Does this make sense? Can someone chime in to lay down the skinny?

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Old 11-17-2008, 03:04 PM   #13 (permalink)
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uberhho -




I don't think that a single EFIE configuration should be connected to the second 02 sensor because I can *see* the 14.7 ratio with the digital A/F gauge. The second 02 sensor is operating in a different range because I can compare readings when I datalog :

Also, it goes against the logic of what I have read regarding closed-loop operation. What I have read tells me that the *first* 02 sensor is used to determine fuel injection at the stoichiometric ratio of 14.7 to 1.

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If you are getting the magic 14.7:1 then I would see no need to do any more trick f&*$ing my friend. Now my question is are you seeing any improvements, if not why?
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Old 11-17-2008, 03:07 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Exclamation

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Originally Posted by cfg83 View Post
basslover911 -



The eagle-research gizmo is designed for narrow-band (0 to 1 volt). I *think* it can be modified to work with wide-band (0 to 5 volt), but I don't remember the website where I read this.

CarloSW2
If you find more information on this it would really help everyone. Does wide-band o2 sensors. I would imagine the schematic to call for different values of components.
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Old 11-17-2008, 03:42 PM   #15 (permalink)
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uberhho -

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If you are getting the magic 14.7:1 then I would see no need to do any more trick f&*$ing my friend. Now my question is are you seeing any improvements, if not why?
I have stopped using it because I want to make sure that I comply with emissions (hence my desire for an affordable NOx sensor in post #5).

In terms of improvement, I have theorized that the SG does not use the 02 sensor output for calculating MPG. Now that you ask, I think that proving this would be a job for the MPGuino.

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Old 11-17-2008, 04:03 PM   #16 (permalink)
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I say when it comes to emissions, take your cat out and sell it for scrap. Use that money to make more systems. Hand it to the man guys. All the EPA is doing is making money off of the masses and we are giving them less business with browns gas. That's why they don't want anyone altering emmision systems, but we have to with HHO. So give it to the man and get HHO in your auto.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:30 PM   #17 (permalink)
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whats wrong with NOx ?

is it definatly created during lean burn or is there some lee-way?
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Old 01-05-2009, 06:13 PM   #18 (permalink)
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modmonster -

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whats wrong with NOx ?
NOx is bad :

Facts on NOx Reduction
http://www.arvinmeritor.com/media_room/pdfs/gp0440.pdf
Quote:
...
What are the health and environmental impacts of NOx?
Human health concerns center on the respiratory system. NOx reacts with ammonia, moisture and other compounds to form nitric acid and related particles. These particles damage lung tissue. Small particles penetrate deeply into sensitive parts of the lungs, and can cause or worsen potentially fatal respiratory diseases such as emphysema and bronchitis. Ground-level ozone (smog) is formed when NOx and volatile organic compounds (VOCs) react with heat and sunlight. Children, asthmatics and people who work or exercise outside are susceptible to adverse effects such as lung tissue damage and decreased lung function. Ozone also damages vegetation and reduces crop yields.Acid rain forms when NOx and sulfur dioxide react with other substances in the air to form acids, which fall to earth with rain, fog, snow or dry particles. Acid rain damages or deteriorates cars, buildings and monuments, as well as causes lakes and streams to become unsuitable for fish.The accumulation of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere is thought to be a factor in global warming. One NOx element is a greenhouse gas.
...
Quote:
is it definatly created during lean burn or is there some lee-way
(Same source as above)
Quote:
...
What is the best solution to reduce NOx?
There is no optimal solution for NOx at this time. Each solution has advantages and disadvantages. SCR has perceived environmental and societal concerns related to it, such as the need for a urea distribution network and the creation of ammonia within the reaction. However, it is a far more advanced solution than NOx traps. NOx traps do not carry the same societal issues, but they are not as advanced technically and in the field. The EPA is trying to balance the societal and technical issues to make sure the best solution is available for heavy-duty trucks for 2007 and 2010. The size of engine, duty cycle and application will all be factors in the ultimate solution.
...
If you "go lean" of the stoichiometric ratio of 14.7 to 1, the good news is that your HC and CO emissions stay nice and low. The bad news is that your NOx emissions increase :

Automotive Electronics Handbook - Google Book Search


This is a conundrum of diesel engines, which "go lean" by design.

CarloSW2

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