04-25-2016, 03:42 PM
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#1 (permalink)
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Batman Junior
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New winter beater: base 2004 Toyota Echo vs. base 1998 Pontiac Firefly (Geo Metro)
So if you follow the Efficient, cheap beaters! Used car ads thread, you know I just picked up this cheap 2004 Toyota Echo. It's going to be next winter's beater car.
And it's the base model. Base, base, BASE!
How base? When I showed it to my dad he chuckled and said, "that's pretty... fundamental." Fundamental as in: no options. No A/C or power steering. It's pretty close to 1998 Firefly base.
It immediately reminded me of the Firefly for its lack of amenities. And then it made me chuckle when I started noting the differences between them.
Things neither car has:
(Things that I bet most car shoppers today would not be OK without...)
- power steering (this surprised me in the Echo... in 2004??)
- air conditioning
- cruise control
- tachometer
- remote hatch release
Things the Echo has that the Firefly doesn't:
- ABS!
- tilt steering!
- dual (A & B) resettable trip odometers (Firefly: none)
- split/folding rear seat (Firefly: folds, but full width)
- cargo cover
- interior-adjustable (manual) side mirrors (Firefly: roll down the window to adjust)
- map lights!
- rear cargo light!
- switches on BOTH doors to turn on the dome light! (Firefly: only on driver's door)
- stowage cubbies galore!
- exterior/lockable hatchback "latch/button"! (Firefly: hatch access requires the key)
- audio (Firefly: came with nothing)
- power! (Over twice the Firefly's HP)
Things the Firefly has that the Echo doesn't
- temperature gauge
- top of class fuel economy (at the time)
Key specs:
- Engine: Echo: 1.5L, DOHC 16v, variable valve timing, 108 hp / 105 ft-lbs
- Firefly: 1.0L, SOHC, 6v, ~50 hp (XFi cam) / 58 ft-lbs
- Curb weight: Echo: 928 kg / 2046 lbs
- Firefly: 813 kg / 1792 lbs
EPA ratings:
- Echo: 30/38/33 (for the sedan 5-speed)
- Firefly: 36/44/40
Driving the Echo reminds me a lot of the base "$9998" 2015 Nissan Micra I got to test drive last year. Similar bare bones mission and power to weight ratio. (Although the 2004 Echo stickered at $14k twelve years ago.)
From: Review notes: 2015 Micra S 5-speed extended test-drive - Darin's thoughts - Micra-Forum.com
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04-25-2016, 03:44 PM
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#2 (permalink)
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Batman Junior
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observed fuel economy
I have stats for both cars on the same 1-way route at the same cruising speed.
~100 km (~60 mi.), 80 km/h (50 mph) cruising speed (some DWL on hills if no following traffic, no more than +/-10 km/h), mild & dry conditions, negligible wind.
It's a scenic country route that includes several stops, passes through 3 towns/hamlets, with easy (EOC-friendly) sub/urban driving at the beginning & end.
Echo: 55 mpg US (not calibrated), bone stock (other than ~50 PSI)
Firefly: 73 mpg US, ecomodded
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04-25-2016, 06:49 PM
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#3 (permalink)
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(:
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You're not going to bathe it in SALT?!?
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04-25-2016, 08:43 PM
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#4 (permalink)
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Batman Junior
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I hear salt baths are soothing.
Based on these rocker panels, this car must feel VERY relaxed.
UPDATE: rust repairs under way...
http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...ics-34525.html
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04-25-2016, 10:31 PM
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#5 (permalink)
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Master EcoModder
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Let the modifications begin. Looks like fun, the days of the Metros are fading fast. I ran them for 8 years, there is only one left in my family now.
__________________
02 Saturn L200 5 speed- 265k miles
84 Gmc 6.5 na diesel K30 4x4, TMU
2006 Lincoln Navigator, 215k miles
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04-26-2016, 04:41 AM
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#6 (permalink)
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Master EcoModder
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That Echo should get better and better mileage as the body parts vaporize or fall off.
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04-26-2016, 09:51 AM
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#7 (permalink)
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Not Doug
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I was not able to keep up very well while at annual training. Did you sell the Civic?
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04-26-2016, 09:59 AM
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#8 (permalink)
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Batman Junior
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I sold the Civic! Don't worry, you're only 2 cars behind.
Latest beaters:
- 2007 Civic (winter 2014/15)
- 2004 Prius (winter 2015/16)
- 2004 Echo (winter 2016/17)
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04-26-2016, 11:27 AM
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#9 (permalink)
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Just cruisin’ along
Join Date: Jul 2009
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The Echo is a fine little car. The low-hanging fruit is easy in this car but I believe it ultimately hits a wall going into 60+ territory. The really high numbers just won't be there.
__________________
'97 Honda Civic DX Coupe 5MT - dead 2/23
'00 Echo - dead 2/17
'14 Chrysler Town + Country - My DD, for now
'67 Mustang Convertible - gone 1/17
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04-26-2016, 11:41 AM
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#10 (permalink)
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Batman Junior
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In what type of driving?
It does have more than enough power for such a light "economy" car. That's going to hold things back for sure.
This one will get my usual suite of ecomods. I'll start a dedicated modding thread for it sometime.
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