The real cost of ownership. Tesla Model 3.

[redpoint5]

First, the guy measures battery drain in miles, which is not an accurate way to measure because the figure changes based on conditions (they call it the guess o meter).

Then the cost of electricity is given at the Manhattan rate of 36 cents per kWh. Nobody is paying that much, except perhaps Manhattan and Hawaii. That's 4.5x more expensive than electricity at Clark PUC, and 3.5x more expensive than PGE (not PG&E).

People that buy new Tesla's aren't complaining about the cost per mile to drive them, or if they are, they are doing life wrong.

[hayden55]

Typically, it's from age related failure of electronic components, or in the case of tesla, they're basically running a control center by default. Can't believe this dude is losing kWh though. I've seen it as a huge huge issue with corvette C5's and 3V mustangs. Apparently soldering is a hard point to do correctly when manufacturing here in the United States. Maybe it's a good thing all of our computer components are produced in Asia.

[serialk11r]

I rented a Model S 70D from Enterprise when they had a discount. It was a nice car to drive in many ways, my main complaint is the sound deadening is pretty awful, especially the wheel well liner. With gasoline as cheap as it is, cost of running it is not a huge advantage, and the capital/depreciation cost of a new car is obviously massive.

The concerns I have are:
-"Over the air update" = critical software is loaded into relatively unreliable storage? The chance of a mid-high 4 digit replacement expense within 15 years is very nontrivial, assuming they even make the parts then.
-There's a lot of rumors that they cut corners on reliability in the software
-When I was driving the car, I pressed the cruise control button but didn't engage cruise control with the stalk, and it just turned on by itself even though I was coming to a red light, I had to brake to avoid hitting the car in front. Who thought this was a good idea?

[hayden55]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

I rented a Model S 70D from Enterprise when they had a discount. It was a nice car to drive in many ways, my main complaint is the sound deadening is pretty awful, especially the wheel well liner. With gasoline as cheap as it is, cost of running it is not a huge advantage, and the capital/depreciation cost of a new car is obviously massive.

The concerns I have are:
-"Over the air update" = critical software is loaded into relatively unreliable storage? The chance of a mid-high 4 digit replacement expense within 15 years is very nontrivial, assuming they even make the parts then.
-There's a lot of rumors that they cut corners on reliability in the software
-When I was driving the car, I pressed the cruise control button but didn't engage cruise control with the stalk, and it just turned on by itself even though I was coming to a red light, I had to brake to avoid hitting the car in front. Who thought this was a good idea?

I'm to the point now where I think Toyota is almost the antithesis of Tesla. Starting to see strong correlation between Toyota's delayed uptake of new technology in the majority of their cars and the strong reliability/Quality/repairability it gives mostly all of them.

[Vman455]

Originally Posted by hayden55

I'm to the point now where I think Toyota is almost the antithesis of Tesla. Starting to see strong correlation between Toyota's delayed uptake of new technology in the majority of their cars and the strong reliability/Quality/repairability it gives mostly all of them.

Toyota takes chances, though--they're just much more measured than what Tesla does, which seems to be "three sheets to the wind and pray it works" a lot of the time. For example, Toyota was the first to market with a production hybrid in 1997. But, they made the decision to go with a robust, proven battery chemistry. But I agree, their (and Honda's) conservatism seems to be the antithesis of Tesla's bleeding edge. It will be interesting to see if that comes back to haunt Toyota in the future, when so many people are already complaining that they haven't announced any BEVs yet.

[redpoint5]

New players to the automotive industry have no choice but to be recklessly innovative. You can't beat the established players at their own game, so you have to try a new game. The established automotive players have a legacy of success, so they must be more conservative so as to not disrupt their proven model.

Tesla has enormous challenges ahead. 2% of vehicle sales are EV, and in the near future, plug-in hybrids are the bridge technology. Tesla has zero plug-in hybrids.

Tesla's party tricks appeal to a few of us technophiles, but most people don't want to read a 500 page manual on how to operate something (which always surprises me. Who spends $50k on something and doesn't read the manual?).

[Fat Charlie]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

Tesla's party tricks appeal to a few of us technophiles, but most people don't want to read a 500 page manual on how to operate something (which always surprises me. Who spends $50k on something and doesn't read the manual?).

That jerk in post #1, among others.

[MeteorGray]

Originally Posted by Vman455

Toyota takes chances, though--they're just much more measured than what Tesla does, which seems to be "three sheets to the wind and pray it works" a lot of the time. For example, Toyota was the first to market with a production hybrid in 1997. But, they made the decision to go with a robust, proven battery chemistry. But I agree, their (and Honda's) conservatism seems to be the antithesis of Tesla's bleeding edge. It will be interesting to see if that comes back to haunt Toyota in the future, when so many people are already complaining that they haven't announced any BEVs yet.

Yep, I doubt you'll see Toyota allow a guy to test their bulletproof window in front of a worldwide audience while their CEO dies a thousand deaths with a silly grin on his face when the window smashes into a thousand pieces.

That was an astounding event. An unforced error. An unforgettable fiasco.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by hayden55

"If you're trying to save the environment, get off your high horse and buy a used car!" *laughing emoji*

Thought this video was pretty funny. I've experienced some of these issues as well with extreme heat or cold with my various batteries.

Thoughts?

I managed to completely waste 1:48 minutes of my waning life before exiting the video.I could learn more from a dirt clod.Thanks for nothing.