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Old 09-12-2020, 06:32 PM   #11 (permalink)
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your little picture show of cars that do not meet the template shows one thing:
Drag reduction does not dictate auto shapes, styling does.

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Old 09-12-2020, 06:44 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyking View Post
your little picture show of cars that do not meet the template shows one thing:
Drag reduction does not dictate auto shapes, styling does.
This is one reason that I keep posting. You have been sucked in: you are working on the fallacious notion that the template = the lowest drag shape for a road vehicle.

That is simply not so:



I guess when the accepted - but incorrect - wisdom has been in place for so long, it's hard to see the wood for the trees.

Or do you really think the Honda Insight designers made some sort of concession to styling on the angle of the rear hatch? That really they wanted a larger wake to match the template - but stylists said no?

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Old 09-12-2020, 06:52 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I would imagine they used those very expensive wind tunnels on the insight. Good for them, we don't have one.
do A,B, or C above represent anything any of us will drive? Give that up, you have an axe to grind.
Does some form of wake reduction? Yes, it does. In that vein, fineness and attached flow, and curves that behave well in the yawed environment do. We don't drive in wind tunnels.
Take a look at the airstream trailer shape. Those huge radii work well from any angle. If you've towed many travel trailers, large box trailers, it's things like that you begin to appreciate.
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Old 09-12-2020, 07:49 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JulianEdgar
In fact my post used the premise 'a pic is worth a 1000 words' and had very few words (115 in fact) in it
How many words in Permalink #3?
Quote:
Take a look at the airstream trailer shape. Those huge radii work well from any angle.
Bucky Fuller used to say that houses are really airships anchored to the Earth (paraphrase).

My Airstream has a wickerbill on the NE corner so the wind blows the door closed instead of open.
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Old 09-12-2020, 08:00 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyking View Post
I would imagine they used those very expensive wind tunnels on the insight. Good for them, we don't have one.
do A,B, or C above represent anything any of us will drive? Give that up, you have an axe to grind.
Does some form of wake reduction? Yes, it does. In that vein, fineness and attached flow, and curves that behave well in the yawed environment do. We don't drive in wind tunnels.
Take a look at the airstream trailer shape. Those huge radii work well from any angle. If you've towed many travel trailers, large box trailers, it's things like that you begin to appreciate.
Sorry, you've lost me.

You don't need an expensive wind tunnel to see that the template is baloney - just do some tuft testing. Zero cost, easy. I don't have a monopoly on testing - do some for yourself.

Furthermore, if the real world, low-drag car shapes developed in a wind tunnel differ substantially from the template, isn't that even more evidence that the template is wrong?

No, A, B and C don't represent what we will drive, just as the template doesn't either. (If it were to meet frontal crash requirements and have minimum head room, I'd suggest a car based on the template would be about 7.4m long. That's about 24 feet.) I ran the solar car pics because you appeared to believe that the template was the lowest drag shape for a road vehicle, and it isn't.

My only axe to grind is against incorrect information being uncritically disseminated.
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Old 09-12-2020, 08:39 PM   #16 (permalink)
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You keep saying 'uncritically'. Search on terms like 'Thee Holy Template' or 'Procrustean bed'. Nevermind I did it for you.
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Old 09-12-2020, 08:46 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freebeard View Post
You keep saying 'uncritically'. Search on terms like 'Thee Holy Template' or 'Procrustean bed'. Nevermind I did it for you.
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Old 09-12-2020, 09:39 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
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You keep saying 'uncritically'. Search on terms like 'Thee Holy Template' or 'Procrustean bed'. Nevermind I did it for you.
Yes I do say 'uncritically'. Ancient, long threads are irrelevant to people coming here and seeing bad advice. Errors need to be called out when they are stated - not 'thanked' as they often are. And the more the errors are repeated, the stronger should be the pushback.

It's just one of those strange beliefs I have - people modifying cars shouldn't be given bad advice. Odd I know...

I mean, you only need to look at the title of this thread - absolute misleading rubbish, that I have seen given here as direct advice to someone wanting guidance on a rear spoiler design.
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Old 09-13-2020, 02:48 AM   #19 (permalink)
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You do you.

It's hard for me to follow nowadays with EcoModder not giving notifications.

Have you thought about putting your energy into the Wiki instead of [contending on] the Forum?
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Old 09-13-2020, 03:04 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by freebeard View Post
You do you.

It's hard for me to follow nowadays with EcoModder not giving notifications.

Have you thought about putting your energy into the Wiki instead of [contending on] the Forum?
Why would I write a Wiki when I have written a book?

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