Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-14-2007, 05:45 PM   #1 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21,203

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.8 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 73.57 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,969
Thanked 5,812 Times in 3,015 Posts
Traffic experiments: a cure for waves and jams (improves other people's MPG too)

This isn't specifically about fuel economy, but it applies.

This guy has written about "standing waves" in traffic, and how a driver either contributes to them, or (as he suggests) can help reduce them.

First off: here's a standing traffic wave, nicely illustrated (You should see an animated gif). We see this all the time:



Now his interest is generally about smoothing things out, but removing this wave (if you could) would also have the effect of collectively saving a lot of fuel by reducing herd mentality braking/accelerating around the wave.

Quote:
The solution seems obvious: drivers with a smooth "calm" style will tend to damp out the waves and produce a uniform flow... and the few drivers who intentionally drive at a single constant speed will wipe out the waves entirely.
He suggests, when you spot a standing wave ahead of you (well ahead), opening up a large gap in front by reducing your speed. When the leading edge of your gap reaches the last car in the standing wave, the wave begins to shrink (cars are still accelerating away from the front of the wave). Ideally, your car reaches the wave area just as the last car accelerates away, and you didn't have to brake to a stop (neither did anyone behind you).

Lots more: http://amasci.com/amateur/traffic/trafexp.html

__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 12-14-2007, 07:35 PM   #2 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 152

The Mighty Mira - '92 Daihatsu Mira
90 day: 61.32 mpg (US)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts
I do this already, as part of hypermiling techniques.

The first initial acceleration I do is usually quick, then I coast. I try and time it so that I should still have some forward velocity by the time the next car starts accelerating, or if the next car will be stopped, by reaching zero velocity by the time I reach that car.

Sometimes I feel like making a flashing red LED sign saying "Red Light/Stopped Traffic Ahead!" to put on the back of my car for the people who insist on honking or extreme tailgating.
__________________
"Every body perseveres in its state of being at rest or of moving uniformly straight forward, except insofar as it is compelled to change its state by force impressed." - Isaac Newton
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2007, 07:40 PM   #3 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21,203

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.8 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 73.57 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,969
Thanked 5,812 Times in 3,015 Posts
I know what you're saying.

The angriest driver I've ever seen was a guy behind me in a truck while I was coasting up to a red light. He was literally screaming at me and gesticulating through his windshield - yet there was nowhere else he could have gone, except to this red light.

Fortunately that's only happened once to me - oh, and it was in Toronto (I generally don't see road rage around here).
__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2007, 07:43 PM   #4 (permalink)
Dartmouth 2010
 
SVOboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hanover, NH
Posts: 6,427

Vegan Powa! - '91 Honda CRX DX
Team Honda
90 day: 66.52 mpg (US)
Thanks: 92
Thanked 114 Times in 82 Posts
Send a message via AIM to SVOboy Send a message via MSN to SVOboy Send a message via Yahoo to SVOboy
Crazy torontulas!

Like newton, I do this already, as part of my ecodriving routine. Really helpful in ~30mph traffic on the highway.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2007, 09:16 PM   #5 (permalink)
MechE
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 1,151

The Miata - '01 Mazda MX-5 Miata
Thanks: 0
Thanked 20 Times in 17 Posts
Great site.... I actually had a somewhat lengthy discussion with my roommate last week about simulating traffic... Traffic is a chaotic system (small input changes yield large output changes) - and is rather difficult to model solely because it's chaotic..... It will likely never happen - it was just fun to brainstorm If anyone wants to -do let me know
__________________
Cars have not created a new problem. They merely made more urgent the necessity to solve existing ones.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2007, 09:19 PM   #6 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21,203

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.8 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 73.57 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,969
Thanked 5,812 Times in 3,015 Posts
Have you seen the site that has the adjustable traffic flow simulation? I'm thinking it's a Java app. Oval track. (If you have, you'll know what I'm talking about.)
__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2007, 01:30 AM   #7 (permalink)
ECO-Evolution
 
Lazarus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 1,482

Iron Horse (retired) - '97 Iron horse Intrepid

Ninja - '08 Kawasaki 250R
90 day: 76.23 mpg (US)
Thanks: 17
Thanked 43 Times in 32 Posts
I love that site. They should do PSA on this traffic stuff. Here's some more applett that are good.
__________________
"Judge a person by their questions rather than their answers."

  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2007, 11:51 AM   #8 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21,203

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.8 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 73.57 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,969
Thanked 5,812 Times in 3,015 Posts
That's the one! Thanks for posting the link.
__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2007, 08:43 PM   #9 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Wasaga Beach,Ontario, Canada
Posts: 5

Roo - '05 Subaru 2.5 RS Impreza
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I often do this flattening out the wave when I'm on my way home from work. Its difficult in the heavier traffic near the plant. So many people especially in automatic cars see the guy in front move forward slightly and then they let off the brakes too and nudge forward usually 5 feet and then put on their brakes again. These annoying mini waves drive me nuts because I refuse to put my car in gear to move forward a couple feet. Sometimes then when the person in front of me actually starts moving and I start to move, if I don't gun it someone from the next lane jumps in. Sometimes its just not worth the bother. What do you guys generally do in heavier traffic?
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2007, 11:52 AM   #10 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21,203

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.8 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 73.57 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,969
Thanked 5,812 Times in 3,015 Posts
Luckily, I don't drive in heavy traffic all that often. But driving a manual shift in genuine stop, wait & crawl situations, where even the "accordion method" can't work, I also won't move the car every time the guy in front of me moves a few feet. But I won't gun it to prevent someone from sneaking in front of me either, despite the reptilian part of my brain screaming at me to stand on the go pedal.

Is this a daily experience for you? If it were for me, I'd be wondering about shifting the departure time a little bit. Sometimes just a short delay can make a big difference if you can avoid the volume peak.

__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com