Travel trailer opinions wanted

[endurance]

While I'm pretty sure it's not what you're looking for, somebody does get it. There's still a small company in Cali making teardrop trailers. Socal teardrops



Not exactly something I'd want to spend the weekend in with the wife, a couple kids and the dog, but definitely perfect for someone wanting something more than a tent, but only has a compact car to tow it with.

[Frank Lee]

I've looked at/admired teardrops whenever I see 'em... but sadly I had to conclude that they are more about style than aero. At least, many of them I've seen seem to have too steep a drop-off at the rear for good flow... so if they have giant trailing wakes across their backsides, one might as well have a cube trailer and enjoy the room.

[dpero]

Originally Posted by dpero

How about your thoughts on this one. I was toying with the idea of building one from scratch but the reality of it (the lack of time) proved otherwise. It is 8.5 ft at it's highest. Never quite finished the design.

No thoughts on this?

[Frank Lee]

Don't ever go off road!

The rear can be a vertical cut... just sayin'.

The upper front can be "sharper", gaining interior standing room with I think no perceptible loss of aero.

Similarly, the boat-tailing of the roof and sides appears shallower than necessary, which unnecessarily cuts into headroom and floorplan room. I think the boat-tailing can start a bit later. Put it up against the aero template.

Something I'd like to see on trailers, which seems to be universally lacking (except on Airstreams) is good radii on the side-to-front and top junctions.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by dpero

No thoughts on this?

Your design is something like what Walter Korff of Lockheed had advocated for an 18-wheeler trailer van in 1963.
He and Kamm and Fachsenfeld would have liked the rear as it embodies the 50 % frontal area cross-section and reduced wake.
I would think about some radius on all your forward and upper edges.
A foil on the tow vehicle and movable gap-fillers between 'vehicles' might allow you extra interior space in the trailer,using the tow vehicle for all the 'penetration' with the trailer in full draft behind.Hucho says there is as much as 10 % extra fuel economy right there.
If you were near a university with a modest wind tunnel you could throw some money at the grad students and let them do a scale-model study.
I have a 22-foot sailboat which will be reversed and inverted to create the body for a 5th-wheel RV trailer with full boat tail.I believe it would pull like magic.
I think yours might too!

[KamperBob]

Originally Posted by dpero

How about your thoughts on this one. I was toying with the idea of building one from scratch but the reality of it (the lack of time) proved otherwise. It is 8.5 ft at it's highest. Never quite finished the design.

I think your concept is a promising start. I'd be happy to help you iterate on design details if you wish to proceed. It's not unrelated to ideas in my head that I may eventually pursue. So just let me know.

Cheers
KB

[slowmover]

To the OP: I don't think you're going to see a significant difference between the two. A box is a box. Non-radiused edges are a killer for mpg AND for crosswind handling (much more important than the last two mpg).

And neither of these trailers is as well built as an all aluminum trailer from earlier years. A used SILVER STREAK, AVION, STREAMLINE or even downmarket AIRSTREAM would be better. Cheaper to buy and longer lasting as well. The joke about todays square white boxes is that they are ten year trailers on a twenty year note. They don't last.

An older, truly aero trailer -- especially one with independent suspension -- is the best bet for fuel mileage and overall costs. What may need to be replaced is straightforward (appliances are generic, as is flooring, etc), and there are large -- very large -- groups of enthusiasts. No need to break trail as it's already been done.

The separation between TV and TT is too great for wings, etc. Treat each vehicle separately.

Get a PRO PRIDE hitch. There is no substitute for a sway-eliminating hitch. The best the rest can do is resist sway. Same for disc brakes on the trailer. Mile for mile, towing doubles the risk of a serious or fatal accident.

And, with that contemplated TV go read everything you can find from Andrew (Andy) Thomson of CAN AM RV in London Ontario.

RV Lifestyle - Hitch Hints & Wagon Masters

Pay special attention to tire/wheel combinations for the TV. Get good tires well matched. NOTHING will make a bigger difference except certified scale hitch rigging (assuming a PP hitch and disc brakes).

Fuel economy doesn't mean much for a traveler only moving 5k annually. It's the guys traveling 10k or more annually who benefit. Keep your speed to 58-62 mph at most. The trailers shown are about good enough to run up to the lake. In clear daylight, with no winds or semi's on the roads.

Depreciation and outrageous increasing maintenance costs make the trailer type shown a true money pit. Mpg decrease is only the icing on the cake.

Economy is the lowest cost over the most years. My folks had their aluminum trailer 27 years, and full-timed for nearly ten of those. They replaced the AC in that time. Nothing else.

I'm in the market for another aero aluminum trailer, and I keep my search confined to 1972-1990.

As to the other subjects on here, keep in mind that the tradeoff between aero and live-ability was worked out more than 50 years ago. The available power in cars, and the state of pre-Interstate highways made aero a highly viable subject. But most of the time spent with a trailer is not in driving. Today's excellent drivetrains, and the Interstate, make 15 mpg easy on a well-spec'd rig. I've seen 18 for European TD SUV's and new 25-28' Airstreams (heavy trailers).

The OP's van can tow a bigger, better trailer than the ones depicted for a lower initial cost, and, once repaired/upgraded, for a lower road cost. With FAR better handling and wind resistance (crosswinds). And an indefinite life.

Good luck

.

[KamperBob]

I have to agree with Phil, Frank and slowmover. Airstream set the standard. Their radii are second to none

and they can last forever with proper care and feeding. So do molded fiberglass trailers from Scamp

and Casita,

plus several others still in production in the US and CAN, and dozens of cousin brands over the years that came and went as a business but the fruits of their products live long and prosper. Boler is the archetypical example (Google image search) being the forefather of Scamp (MN) and Casita (TX) FWIW. Airstream makes 19'+ campers for 2+ people which hold their value well but you may need lots of these

to join the ranks. Molded fiberglass "eggs" (as we affectionately refer to them) in 13'-19' sizes sleep 2-6 within a Class II (3500# GVW) rating that is truly fuel friendly. They also last decades (I just sold a nice 88) and you can get in the game for much less cash investment making the value excellent. BTW my 19' fifth wheel Scamp (pic, pic) is sway proof being pinned over the truck's rear axle. I'll press my luck by repeating a link to Egg Central (bookmarks) for anyone who wants to learn more about these wonderful campers then back off so as not to hijack this thread.

Cheers
KB

[slowmover]

I was admiring the teardrop shaped travel trailer idea shown above, and wish to add these 1940's designed travel trailer pics and a video for consideration. Wally Byam, the founder of Airstream is given credit for the all aluminum travel trailer. The man was a marketing genius of sorts, and for those of us who love car camping, his death in the mid-1960's marked a turning point. But during the war there were plenty of others who'd seen, thought and experienced travel trailers from the 1920's forward, and the sheer number of skilled sheet metal workers and aluminum fabrication facilities in Southern California from airplane production led to other companies as well, and they charted their own paths. One of these companies to form was the SILVER STREAK Corporation. Over it's years of production (ending in the 1990's) they turned out but a handful of trailers per week and never suffered, as did Airstream, the vagaries and cost cutting of changed ownership. And they always built to a higher standard than did AIRSTREAM.

During the 1950's these two competing companies built a highly similar trailer from their joint venture under CURTIS WRIGHT Corporation during the early postwar years. By 1960 things had changed in design direction. Below are links to pictures and a video of early '50's SILVER STREAK trailers.

#"VINTAGE!" 1954 Silver Streak Clipper..

1953 silver streak clipper | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbDtE2xkssA

better shelter blog: 1952 Silver Streak Trailer

1953Clipper


The restored trailers you see here are expensive. Think sailboat/airplane/1930's Packard. The appeal is timeless, as the shape and interior design is an outstanding version of form following function.

Trailers aren't on the road -- for most Americans -- much more than 5k miles per year. Even those who fulltime may not run 20k annually. After all, the point is to have comfortable accommodations at a variety of locations across the continent. No unpacking in a strange hotel. No reliance on generic fast food. Mediated privacy as I see it, for RV campgrounds run the gamut from cheap (free overnight at WalMart parking lot) to exclusive members-only resort quality. Plus state, national, Corps of Engineers, etc. So a trailer is mostly about 3-day to 2-month flexibility in only a few locations.

And the era of these trailers ended in the 1970's. Until this point it was doctors, lawyers, business owners . . these trailers cost as much as a starter home. In todays money, over $100k (for early 1970's comparisons of larger units). Some even more. But all of them well more than a new Cadillac or BMW. The ruination of the airlines -- called de-regulation -- and the ascendance of finance since 1980 (longer work hours, fewer benefits, women having to work) PLUS the increase in fuel costs (Peak Oil having arrived in the US after 1970) caused those who could afford these trailers to fly and rent on their shortened vacations. AIRSTREAM survives due to deeper corporate pockets, but cheapened construction (and glitzy interiors) as a sort of prestige brand for it's owner (THOR).

Enough of context. Note the length and the accommodations. Search elsewhere for capacities (fuel, fresh water, holding tank) as well as weights. The entry and exit angles reduce interior space without a commensurate interior benefit (and expensive, fitted interior not amenable to assembly lines). More powerful cars and better roads plus a desire for a bigger set of trailers ended the era of the Clippers.

I would offer that this is still -- likely -- the best overall shape for a travel trailer as headroom and shoulder room do not change. I've had the time to view one (a survivor) and the ingenuity of fittings (interior accommodations) is excellent whether standing or sitting. While I prefer a later shape and larger size (for extended travel), these trailers shown offer an outstanding blend of road-ability and live-ability.

It is the latter which most matters. Fuel economy is down mainly to the tow vehicle. Aero means more than weight. But live-ability trumps road-ability at an early point. I believe the trailers shown in links above are still the best point of departure for modern iterations where aerodynamic considerations are fundamental.

.

[dpero]

I purchased the Visa and picked it up last weekend. I compared an actual picture to what I posted earlier... the gap between them is a little bigger than the "concept" photo. Obvouslly not good for aero.



I kept a close look on the MPG on the way home. There was a 30mph'ish crosswind most of the way.

Highway averaging 63mph: 10.5 mpg

Reset the onboard computer and drove another 30 miles off the highway averaging 53mph; 11.5mpg

The entire trip there w/o trailer; 69mph avg, 24.5mpg.