U.S. wants consumers' advice on fuel-economy stickers

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by Piwoslaw

Here's my fuel-economy window sticker:

At least yours have arrived

If this is about labelling why not concentrate on what most consumers are going to look at :

Range (ok on a basic standard route but that is what official MPG is anyway)
Time to charge from stopped to full.
Max speed
0-30, 0-50 or whatever seems appropriate.
Cost of a full charge.

Whatever measures are used the manufacturers will maximise something by tuning their products to match. I suppose if the labelling is biased toward what the consumer wants then maybe we get what we want.

Maybe.

[SoobieOut]

Since this country will eventually go to Metric, like the rest of the world. I propose using a sign showing simple miles per KWH and 100 Kilometers per KWh rating.

This way the same rating can be used for both Electric and Gas/diesel cars.


Also it would make it much easier to transition to the metric system like we were promised by congress a VERY long time ago.

Forget about the A,B,C ratings systems idea since automakers accounting guru's will find a loophole to exploit that system.

[rmay635703]

This sign business is a non-issue to me the purpose of a fuel economy sign is to say how much of what is required to go a certain distance or vice versa.

That said for comparision purposes I hope to god they put cost per mile information directly below each fuel economy listing

AKA
Gas Electric
City 32mpg 5mpkwh
Cost per mile $0.09 $0.02

And furthermore the other fluff is fine just so long as the meat and potatoes is always there. They can lable it Rating Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious for all I care.

And yes I sent the same to the government except with more detail.

[Thymeclock]

Originally Posted by PaleMelanesian

Here's my input:

Just give us the information. List any that apply: Miles per gallon city/hwy. Electric - either battery capacity and kwh / mile electric city/hwy, or range city/hwy and kwh to recharge.

Don't try to interpret it for us, or tell us what's better for us. We can figure that out. Whether we as individuals will make wise decisions is a separate matter that does not need to be brought into this discussion. No letter grades, thank you.

I couldn't agree more. But you are a bit naive in your request or expectation. We must realize that both the government and the auto manufacturers have a vested interest in putting some 'spin' on the numbers on the sticker, to influence your choice in what you buy. (And a rating of "A" to "D" is even worse, because it is purely subjective, imparting no useful information or standard of measurement.)

Case in point: I've bought various cars since city/highway EPA ratings began, and I've always found the estimates to be very accurate, to within 1 MPG of what was stated on the sticker. Not so with my newest car: a 2009 Chevy Aveo automatic, MPG listed as 37 highway/ 25 city. GM hyped the car as having excellent highway MPG and, to their credit, that figure is accurate - the car DOES get 37 MPG highway. However, in city driving it gets only 22 MPG, not the 25 that is stated on the sticker. My ScanGauge doesn't lie. And no, it's not how it is driven - even if Jesus Christ or Barack Obama were to drive it, there is no way this car can ever get more than 22 MPG in city driving. (The reason it can't is because of the way the A/T was programmed by GM. It is a slushbox with the converter lockup occurring only after it reaches speeds of higher than 45 MPH.) Unfortunately ALL our driving is done at under speeds of 45 MPH, which is what city driving IS.

The US government in effect now owns and controls General Motors. When the government controls both the regulatory agency and the car manufacturer there is a compelling motive to influence what we buy, even it it means fudging the numbers. But we can't hold the government accountable for anything it does. And there is no way the consumer can be certain whether the EPA estimate is realistic until he actually buys the car. As the convenient, slippery disclaimer says, "your mileage may vary".

[euromodder]

Originally Posted by PaleMelanesian

Don't try to interpret it for us, or tell us what's better for us. We can figure that out.

I respectfully disagree

The US car market clearly shows that consumers don't buy what's best for them, far less what's best for the planet.
The manufacturers happily obliged.
Excessive size, weight and engine displacement became the norm rather than the exception, but all was well for most US car buyers.
Until gas prices soared.

[gone-ot]

...which is worse?

A) the GOVERNMENT deciding what's best for you & me (control oriented)?

...or,

B) the MANUFACTURERS deciding what's best for you & me (profit oriented)?



...both, reach decisions via committee's (ie: Camel = Horse designed by committee).

[Thymeclock]

Originally Posted by Old Tele man

...which is worse?

A) the GOVERNMENT deciding what's best for you & me (control oriented)?

...or,

B) the MANUFACTURERS deciding what's best for you & me (profit oriented)?

"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." (H. L. Mencken)

Democracy is to politics what consumerism is to economics.

We deserve to get it -"good and hard" - and ultimately we have ourselves to blame.

[gone-ot]

...let me paraphrase and clarify my statement somewhat: "...how do you like to be screwed? Because of someone elses' CONTROL over you, or by someone elses' PROFIT from you?

[t vago]

I'd prefer the latter, because at least I can go take my dollars and go to a competitor if somebody doesn't make what I want. Or as a last resort, I could build my own.

You get no such chance at all with the government. You're forced at gunpoint to accept whatever the government tells you to have. Don't agree with that statement? Don't pay your income taxes, and see what happens.

[gone-ot]

GOVERNMENT = sanctioned aristocracy.

BUSINESS = sanctioned ponzi and pyramid entities.




...I'm not prejudiced, I HATE everybody equally (ha,ha)