Unintended Acceleration ?

[toc]

@toc - thats the same in most cars nowadays - I think the old fashioned cable in my Aygo is still just connected to the ECU.

In a key operated car of course you can turn the key. What do I do if the Prius ignores the off button ? I know - hold it in for 6 seconds - works in PCs

You'll need to disconnect the batteries. One for the ICE, and the other for the EV power pack.

A simple on / off switch direct to the power sources, that'll stop it.
"Emergency Stop" for Prius.

Oh, use thick gauge cable, I hear DC Battery Packs in cars contain something of a high voltage.

What's with taking the keys out of cars these days anyway ?
Would feel weird not turning the key to start it. The ads here in Aus promote it - 'woo - a button instead of a key'.. What about fuel economy, still back in the 90's? Yep.

[bwilson4web]

Practice shifting into "N". Also teach your wife or any other drivers. It is not a natural act so practice is needed. Tell them,"Shift to N to live."

Shifting to "N" is the fastest way to decouple power from the wheels and completely safe. The engine ECU will quickly return to idle rpm and if you are moving, just pull to the side of the road, set the parking brake and then:

PLEASE TAKE A PHOTO AND/OR MPEG!

Then make calls as you have documented the stuck accelerator. Call the dealer and let them know where the car is and you have a photo of the problem. You have no idea how many people will want copies.

Bob Wilson

[Daox]

After the huge uproar with the unintended acceleration Toyota reprogrammed things so that if the brake pedal is held down it overrides the accelerator pedal signal. You shouldn't have any problems that can't easily be delt with by just pusing the bake.

[euromodder]

Originally Posted by Arragonis

When I lifted the pedal didn't come up so its more a physical thing, although cruise does hold the pedal position?

I Wish

It holds speed.
Pushing the throttle overrides the CC.

[Phantom]

Originally Posted by Daox

After the huge uproar with the unintended acceleration Toyota reprogrammed things so that if the brake pedal is held down it overrides the accelerator pedal signal. You shouldn't have any problems that can't easily be delt with by just pusing the bake.

From some of the Toyota reports the problem was driver error and the tests showed that the driver never tried to use the brake. Arragonis did you try the brake

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by Phantom

Arragonis did you try the brake

Somewhat strangely my instinct was that the pedal was stuck so I prodded it to unstick it - no idea why I did that on reflection but its what happened. There was nothing in front as I had set off from rest and I was at the front of the line both times. It "unstuck" and the ICE turned off and control was resumed in leccy mode. That made me think that I had a mat or something in the way but I checked after the first time and nothing was there. I know the brake overrides everything, that was in volume 2 of the 1000+ page manual

Update - I took it to the stealer and of course got the rolling eyes skyward treatment and the lots of "are you sure this is what happened sir ?" type questions. They took it away to check it over and I was provided with a sympathy coffee in their waiting area. After 12 holes of Golf on Tiger Woods 2007 (I think) on a very tired PS2 and CRT TV (remember them ?) they came back and declared nothing wrong. They suggested a mat, I said not. They pointed out the mats in the boot but they have been in there for a couple of weeks and not on the floor.

More rolling eyes. Time to give up as Mrs A still thinks it didn't happen and won't unless it happens to her. It has 6k miles on it now, and I've only driven a hundred or so, so I suppose if it was going to happen it would have done so with her.

I'm going to borrow it for an evening and try it again on the same roads which were very quiet so little chance of stacking it into something. But for the moment, it remains a mystery - a little like that time I was taken aboard a *UFO....

(*joke about people not believing me as I'm the only witness, not that this is a hoax...)

[bwilson4web]

Just a couple of points about shifting into "N" . . . it effectively removes all power to MG1 and MG2. Without MG1 and MG2, the engine will continue to run in "idle" until it runs out of fuel. So with an MPEG, you'll have sound as well as the position of the accelerator.

One problem with my wife's floor mats were the hooks that anchor them were missing.

I went to the local dealer for the cheezy, plastic hooks and anchored the mat. Three months later the Saylor family died in a Lexus SUV when the wrong model, all-weather mat, jammed the accelerator.

The Saylor crash happened in San Diego and the run-away took long enough for a cell phone call. The Lexus SUV jumped a bank, rolled and burned. The accelerator and all-weather mat melted together. The same car and floor mat had been reported to the dealer several days earlier as causing the accelerator to stick.

Now I'm sure that 99% of the 'unintended' acceleration incidents are driver error. Trying to hit the brake for a reason and they somehow hit the accelerator with little time to recover (they were braking for a reason.) I read about them frequently in lots of vehicles from different vendors and usually it involves an older driver. But my mind has always been open to the possibility of other defects.

One reason is I've been refurbishing NHW11 accelerators. This is how one came in:

The cam-follower arm is not designed to be bent and sure enough, I found it tended to bind at full acceleration. I actually didn't know it was bent until my testing after cleaning the contacts revealed the problem.

I bought and looked inside an NHW20 accelerator and it too as some extra linkages.

It is better sealed and all plastic but from what I could tell, the extra linkages are unnecessary except to increase the Hall-effect sensor angular range. I have not gotten a ZVW30 accelerator assembly to inspect and test.

Bob Wilson

[cfg83]

Arragonis -

Originally Posted by Arragonis

...

More rolling eyes. Time to give up as Mrs A still thinks it didn't happen and won't unless it happens to her. It has 6k miles on it now, and I've only driven a hundred or so, so I suppose if it was going to happen it would have done so with her.

...

I don't know. If you are hypermiling the car then Mrs A may not invoke the sequence of actions that led to what you experienced. It's a common problem in software. The developer implements a feature and tests it using a sequence of actions that prove it works. User X finds a problem but does not describe *their* sequence of actions, so the developer is unable to recreate the problem. I call it the "Pachinko Machine" because the developer and user are executing different paths through the software that yield different outcomes.

CarloSW2

[Arragonis]

Good point - Mrs A is not Hypermiling, she seems to have a target of as many battery re-gens as possible - I'm trying to say to her thats not quite the target we are after

If I can get it to recreate it then I'll have something to go back to the stealer with.

[cfg83]

Arragonis -

Originally Posted by Arragonis

Good point - Mrs A is not Hypermiling, she seems to have a target of as many battery re-gens as possible - I'm trying to say to her thats not quite the target we are after

If I can get it to recreate it then I'll have something to go back to the stealer with.

The best thing is that "one of us" is looking at this, so we should get the real skinny into what is going on. Bad for you, but you're helping the cause of Ecomodder Science, .

CarloSW2