Wal-Mart aero-mods 1,000 of its 7,000 semi-trucks?

[Big Dave]

Aerohead:
We are thinking very close. I start with three things.
1.Lengthen out my 80" box to 100"
2.A diamond plate load deck and side walls
3.A transition bulkhead to present the cleanest possible transition from the cab shape to the "squashed oval" before you reach the wheel wells

At some point you have to make a shape for a job. Pickups are designer nightmares because of the wide range of missions they are asked to do. Caps are popular, so I deduce many people can live without the open bed, but the classic pickup mission is 4x8s. If you can haul 4x8s, you've got a truck.

Got a question. My C-pillar wil induce a vortex. Would it be better to use metal "fences" to pin the vortex on top of the bed or would it be better to quickly toss it to the side. I'm thinking the forner but mostly intuition. Aircraft use fence to pin the votices on top of the lifting surface, but then they are looking for more lift. Winglets are nothing more than fences that hold the tip vortex on the wing. Whaddaya think?

Jamesqf:
I'm a Kelly Johnson kinda guy. Keep It Simple Stupid. Electrify the main lines and Interstates. That is where the high load-high speed (ergo high fuel consumption) action is. Let the IC engine do what it does best, providing flexibility. I remember the old urban trolley catenaries. I also remember people hated those things.

BTW trains have been doing pulse and glide from the git-go. An engineer will run his train under power til he passes the "ruling grade" of the segment then he coasts the rest of the way. Sometimes the ruling grade is the next division point but that means the train going to opposite direction passes his ruling grade at the yard limit.

[bondo]

Wal Mart has been involved in testing new fuel saving devices and technologies for heavy trucks for years. In the latter 1980's into the 1990's Wal Mart ran International cabover style trucks exclusively in their fleet. These flat front cabs were like driving a brick down the freeway and I remember when you passed them, you could feel the bow wake coming off the front of the truck push your car sideways. That is a lot of energy wasted.

With this in mind, in 1988 I designed and Patented an aerodynamic "nosecone" which fit on the front of these cabover style trucks, below the front windshield and above the front bumper. The nosecone "optimized" the frontal area of the flat front cabover style truck affording a more slipstream shape. I approached Wal Mart with the product in 1989 and they were interested.

The road tests conducted by Wal Mart showed an increase in the fuel efficiency of the test trucks fitted with a nosecone but it was not a large enough fuel savings for Wal Mart to buy the nosecone for their fleet. The Wal Mart representative I worked with told me if Diesel fuel had been at $2.00 a gallon or more they would definitely buy the nosecone for the up front cost of the aerodynamic device would be justified by the amount of money it would save in Diesel fuel cost per vehicle over one years time. That was 20 years ago though and Diesel fuel was $0.87 a gallon. Timing is everything.

Sadly, the aerocap is in a state of inertia now. The camper shell company which had agreed to produce them for me in October of last year has had financial problems, like many other manufacturing companies, thanks to the Wall Street melt down. Maybe someday I will be able to develop a product and have better timing than I did with the nosecone 20 years ago, and now the aerocap.

I do hope our domestic automobile manufacturers will survive so there will continue to be new pickup trucks made to put aerocaps on. I do hope this new administration will provide Government money for developing green technologies and just not talk about it like past administrations. I do hope there is an investigation into the Sub-Prime Mortgage, Credit Default Swap meltdown and that the people who stole from others, like Bernie Madoff, pay for their crimes. Think about how much reasearch and development of green technologies could have been funded by just ONE PERCENT of the $700,000,000,000.00 bailout. What a luxury it would be not having to fund the development of products like the nosecone and aerocap with my own money. But you can bet, I will spend my last dime doing so before I will steal money from others like the Wall Street gang has. Please, accept my apology for venting but I am just little dismayed at the thought we the taxpayers, our children and even their children paying back all the tax money being spent on the TARP bailout.

Bondo

[Big Dave]

Good looking nose cone, Bondo. Cabovers blow even one-ton picks around.

Hang in there on your manufacturer.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by Big Dave

Aerohead:
We are thinking very close. I start with three things.
1.Lengthen out my 80" box to 100"
2.A diamond plate load deck and side walls
3.A transition bulkhead to present the cleanest possible transition from the cab shape to the "squashed oval" before you reach the wheel wells

At some point you have to make a shape for a job. Pickups are designer nightmares because of the wide range of missions they are asked to do. Caps are popular, so I deduce many people can live without the open bed, but the classic pickup mission is 4x8s. If you can haul 4x8s, you've got a truck.

Got a question. My C-pillar wil induce a vortex. Would it be better to use metal "fences" to pin the vortex on top of the bed or would it be better to quickly toss it to the side. I'm thinking the forner but mostly intuition. Aircraft use fence to pin the votices on top of the lifting surface, but then they are looking for more lift. Winglets are nothing more than fences that hold the tip vortex on the wing. Whaddaya think?

Jamesqf:
I'm a Kelly Johnson kinda guy. Keep It Simple Stupid. Electrify the main lines and Interstates. That is where the high load-high speed (ergo high fuel consumption) action is. Let the IC engine do what it does best, providing flexibility. I remember the old urban trolley catenaries. I also remember people hated those things.

BTW trains have been doing pulse and glide from the git-go. An engineer will run his train under power til he passes the "ruling grade" of the segment then he coasts the rest of the way. Sometimes the ruling grade is the next division point but that means the train going to opposite direction passes his ruling grade at the yard limit.

Big Dave,I think that any portion of the open bed will have the vorticity.Any extension to the roofline which tapers gently,as along the aerodynamic teardrop template ( top and sides ),will reduce the magnitude of the "wake" behind the cab and it's locked-vortex.With the addition of a properly configured rear spoiler,you could possibly "tailor"the vortex to a minimum and the surrounding flow would generally pass over it as if it were a solid structure.------------- For my own projects I always attempt to first to minimize the separated area,then work from there.I don't know if I'm muddying the waters so I'll wait for a response before I ramble on futher.

[Sunwapta]

The Futureliner looks like it came from a time when GM had vision.

So what's the most efficient way to split the air equally over the top and sides or push a bit more to the sides like the Futureliner? (Looks like it would have created a bit of upward air movement along its length as pressure equalized.)

[Sunwapta]

Originally Posted by Daveedo

like the futurliner?
The GM Futurliner Restoration Project

Here's the link from page one of his thread.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by Sunwapta

The Futureliner looks like it came from a time when GM had vision.

So what's the most efficient way to split the air equally over the top and sides or push a bit more to the sides like the Futureliner? (Looks like it would have created a bit of upward air movement along its length as pressure equalized.)

Sunwapta,I believe you are correct about the air movement along the sides of the Futurliner.Unlike a pure 1/4 convex hemispherical windshield,the GM's has a tighter radius over the top,than at the sides.Air would accelerate faster over the roof than along the sides,so pressures would vary accordingly.The solution would be the ideal symetrical "bubble" form,with constant velocity,matching the plan radius of the nose.

[oldpecan]

well I STILL haven't seen any Kamm-back flaps or under-trailer skirting on a semi-trailer.
I don't get out very much, though.

anyway here's a print version of some of the points made in the CNBC video of Wal-Mart's truck fleet's efficiency improvements of all kinds:

(and the fellow's name is spelled Chris Sultemeier)

Green Car Congress: Wal-Mart Estimates 50% of Fleet Efficiency Gain by 2015 Could Come from Vehicle Technology, 50% from Operational Improvement

btw I think that Congress should give "bondo" the poster above, $785 Billion worth of Bondo. and "carte blanche" to apply it as he sees fit. That would end our dependence on foreign oil right then and there. I'm only half kidding. and give aerohead $785 Billion for AluPo and carbon-fiber

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by oldpecan

well I STILL haven't seen any Kamm-back flaps or under-trailer skirting on a semi-trailer.
I don't get out very much, though.

anyway here's a print version of some of the points made in the CNBC video of Wal-Mart's truck fleet's efficiency improvements of all kinds:

(and the fellow's name is spelled Chris Sultemeier)

Green Car Congress: Wal-Mart Estimates 50% of Fleet Efficiency Gain by 2015 Could Come from Vehicle Technology, 50% from Operational Improvement

btw I think that Congress should give "bondo" the poster above, $785 Billion worth of Bondo. and "carte blanche" to apply it as he sees fit. That would end our dependence on foreign oil right then and there. I'm only half kidding. and give aerohead $785 Billion for AluPo and carbon-fiber

oldpecan,I tried google images for The Waggoners Trucking Co. but struck out.They run a fully tricked-out 18-wheeler,complete with 48-inch boat-tail.I've talked with their drivers but they do not track mpg on the rigs.The drivers told me to contact their offices to learn about the details however I never seem to find the time.I have a reference for a rig that won a mpg contest in the 1980s,they got about 10.5 mpg,but I think gvw was only around 71,000 lbs and speed was averaging only low 50-mph territory.Rigs have been researched and have demonstrated drag coefficients of Cd 0.26 and depending on starting point,and along with engine and powertrain,offered mpg gains on the order of 58%.Again.it all depends on where you're beginning from.The rigs hit a technological "wall" at some popint,and without radical modifications to the trailer,are hamstrung against any further savings.I think it's time for tractor manufacturers to get in the trailer business.

[oldpecan]

Thanks for the info, aero.

I'd say 71,000 lbs is pretty high---isn't 80,000 a typical top weight?

I looked around Waggoners Trucking Home Page a bit, but I only found this confusing reference and inconclusive picture:

"... nose and rear bubble cones for added clearance and vehicle protection..."

(no mention of aerodynamics, but the photo of the blue tractor-trailer seems to show some kind of structure on there behind the rear corner of the trailer, but the photo's too small)

The Waggoners Trucking (Compay Info) [then click on "Equipment"]

I did notice Waggoners has a specialty of transporting wind turbine blades

btw: Did their drivers you talked to say that the boattails were a big headache at the loading dock? Could they feel a difference at 65 mph?