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Old 07-28-2011, 01:21 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Woohoo! The mother earth hybrid plans came today!

7-10 days my foot!

Came in 3.

Gonna start studying today!

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Old 07-28-2011, 04:25 PM   #2 (permalink)
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What is it?
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:40 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Cheap homemade hybrid. The plans are old, but after just a glance, simple and easily updateable.

Take a look...................Electric Car Conversion: The Amazing 75-MPG Hybrid Car
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:39 PM   #4 (permalink)
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A few things worry me, first off, the battery pack is way undersized, they state that you can charge the pack off the 100 amp alternator in 15 minutes... that would make a pack drained to 50% a 50 amp hour pack, way to small for most electric cars.
And the "secret" to making it work... a pulsed speed controller, only they are using mechanical produced pulses it sounds like, an Open ReVolt would be better, be more efficient and last longer.

Otherwise it's the same idea as the Ford F1 that is on Ebay right now and the same idea as Ben's hybrid Geo Metro.
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:52 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Only it was done 30 some odd years ago. After looking at the plans, it's simple enough, and with some modernising ( controller wise of course, I was thinking about the OpenRevolt ), possibly a capacitor bank ( who knows, I'm just thinking out loud; make my own supercap or ultracap ).

I just want to see what'll happen.

For some reason, a series hybrid generates a lot of controversy, so I have to see what the big deal is all about.
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Old 07-28-2011, 06:29 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Do you have an Electric Vehicle already?

The problem is all the losses going from gasoline through an engine through a generator through a conditioner through a controller through a motor, all to rotate a shaft (which the motor was doing in the first place).

If you add charging and discharging batteries to the mix it gets even worse as there are charging circuits and charge is a loss and discharge is a loss.

I have said before, if you want to replace the chain on your 10 speed with an alternator and a motor, and you think you will be doing less work as a result, go for it.

So far the champions of series hybrids haven't produced one single real world measurement to support their position. They think that motors/generators/controllers are all 90+% efficient all the time and that drivers cannot possibly manage a stick shift to keep the engine near peak efficiency, and that batteries are perfect.

Even if it were as simple as generator->controller->motor all at 90% efficiency, that is still a %27 loss of power before you get back to a rotating shaft. And without batteries you cannot operate the engine "automatically" at peak efficiency any longer than even a half educated driver with a stick shift.

Therein lies the "controversy", people not questioning series hybrid losses and assuming stupid drivers. And these same people may just usher in a new era of sloppy ass automatic transmissions that keep people stupid.
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Old 07-28-2011, 06:41 PM   #7 (permalink)
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The one advantage and this is where the Chevy Volt fell short, is if you can keep your gas engine running at it's optimum speed then you might do ok.
I don't believe them of course when they say that a 5hp gas engine is going to power that car until it runs out of gas, I suppose in stop and go traffic it could, but never for highway driving.
It is a nice idea tho, save a few thousand dollars on batteries and still have an electric car for short trips and a car that gets decent mileage for longer trips.
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Old 07-28-2011, 07:09 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cleanspeed1 View Post
For some reason, a series hybrid generates a lot of controversy, so I have to see what the big deal is all about.
I get that too.
I have a Chevy S-10 in a barn I want to convert to electric in the next year or 2. Using the warp11 electric motor on a 192vdc lead-acid system, with my diesel generator in the back for use as a range extender.
I want to get all the advantages of having an "electric vehicle" but don't want the 40 mile or so extention cord leash.

EV Source - NetGain WarP 11 Electric Motor
I hope its big enough.
No really, this thing could snap the stock GM 10-bolt rear end found in these trucks if I can get a motor controler that can handle the power.
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Old 07-28-2011, 07:18 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcb View Post
Do you have an Electric Vehicle already?

The problem is all the losses going from gasoline through an engine through a generator through a conditioner through a controller through a motor, all to rotate a shaft (which the motor was doing in the first place).

If you add charging and discharging batteries to the mix it gets even worse as there are charging circuits and charge is a loss and discharge is a loss.

I have said before, if you want to replace the chain on your 10 speed with an alternator and a motor, and you think you will be doing less work as a result, go for it.

So far the champions of series hybrids haven't produced one single real world measurement to support their position. They think that motors/generators/controllers are all 90+% efficient all the time and that drivers cannot possibly manage a stick shift to keep the engine near peak efficiency, and that batteries are perfect.

Even if it were as simple as generator->controller->motor all at 90% efficiency, that is still a %27 loss of power before you get back to a rotating shaft. And without batteries you cannot operate the engine "automatically" at peak efficiency any longer than even a half educated driver with a stick shift.

Therein lies the "controversy", people not questioning series hybrid losses and assuming stupid drivers. And these same people may just usher in a new era of sloppy ass automatic transmissions that keep people stupid.

Your arguments are valid, but at the same time there is a question in my mind beyond the theoretical about a system like this.

Can the losses be minimized in the system considering time and technology?

We're gonna find out.
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Old 07-28-2011, 09:07 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
I get that too.
I have a Chevy S-10 in a barn I want to convert to electric in the next year or 2. Using the warp11 electric motor on a 192vdc lead-acid system, with my diesel generator in the back for use as a range extender.
I want to get all the advantages of having an "electric vehicle" but don't want the 40 mile or so extention cord leash.

EV Source - NetGain WarP 11 Electric Motor
I hope its big enough.
No really, this thing could snap the stock GM 10-bolt rear end found in these trucks if I can get a motor controler that can handle the power.
NetGain is in my neck of the woods, and the 11" will snap drivetrain parts.

I'm looking forward to doing this.

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