LED Headlight Issues: Amperage and Fuses

[OG VX]

Hello all,
I started to go to Honda-Tech.com to make a thread there. But, honestly, trust the opinions here more, even though that's a Honda-specific forum.

Problem: I just installed some LED H4 headlight bulbs. I run them alongside my OEM fog lights. All was well when I first installed them. However, on my first trip to work, I noticed a buzzing noise coming from behind the steering wheel area. So, I turned off the headlights, noise went away. Waited a few minutes, turned them back on. Was good for another 15 minutes, than the buzz came back on. Sounds like a buzzing alarm, like on a dryer when it completes its drying cycle of your clothes. A bit more faint, but that's the tone.

So, I got home and installed 20A fuses, rather than the (factory-spec) 10A. That seemed to solve the issue. They now drive about twice as long, before I get my first buzzing incident (about 25-30 minutes). Then, I have to either turn the headlights off, OR turn off my fogs. In fact, I can sit there and push the fog light switch on and off and here the buzzing go on and off. When the fogs are turned on, the buzzing noise happens AND the headlights bulbs turn off.

Today, I tried running 30A fuses. Same thing happened. This is getting ridiculous.

So, my questions at this point:

1. Am I doing the right thing by continually raising the fuse ratings? I'm not going above 30, as that just seems ridiculous...

2. Could I melt anything/wiring running on 20 or 25 amp fuses in slots designated by factory to be 10 amps?

3. Where is the buzzing coming from? It sounds like it's (literally) right behind the fog light button/switch on the dash. Is there a fuse back there in the OEM wiring or is the buzzing possibly coming form the switch itself? Anyone know?

This has been an issue of late, as I have to turn off the headlights on longer trips or (as I discovered today), or run the headlights without the fog lights on.

Currently, I think my solution here is:

-Return bulbs (I hope not, as I like them so far, aside from this issue)

or

-Locate a fuse in the fog light harness that needs to be upped a bit in amperage as well.

What are your thoughts? All in all, I want a safe car, and I certainly don't want these lights to cost me fuel. I got them (partially) to decrease amperage/load on the engine and perhaps even gain a few sips of fuel each tank.

Also, I have contacted the Ebay Seller. We'll see what he says as well.

Thanks for any counsel you can give.

[2000mc]

In theory the LEDs should be less of a load, and I can't think of why they would cause this. I think I would go back to running the regular bulbs, at least long enough to be certain the bulbs are the cause of this

[markweatherill]

The LED bulbs will be much less of a load than the halogens.

Conceivably it's RFI from the bulbs?

What wattage are they and what's the beam pattern and light output like?

[Ecky]

I can't imagine why raising fuse ratings, if the fuses aren't blowing, would help.

[oil pan 4]

Good move, I have been on the Honda forums and can be about as intelligent as the gasbuddy.com forum or a middle school lunch table.

On vehicles I have done LED conversions I run lower amp fuses, I figure that since the LED draws so little power compared to the old style light bulb if there is a wiring fault with the standard lights load removed it could burn up the wire before it pops the fuse.

I have no idea what could be going on there in the dash of your car. The only thing I can possibly imagine is that maybe your vehicle is doing what it is supposed to be doing and you have some kind of "head light out alarm" going off due to lack of current draw.
Verify this by replacing the LEDs with the proper head light lamps, drive around make sure this buzzing is gone. Then try removing one or both head lights and turning the switch on, see if the buzzing returns. If the buzzing returns with one or no OEM head lights installed and when ever you have the LEDs in then you will need to run a ballast resistor so the circuit will draw the same amount of power as standard head lights with the LEDs installed.

Or open up the dash, find the buzzer, remove it if possible then smash it with a hammer (just out of spite).

If one less head light or both head lights being removed can not reproduce the noise then you may have stumbled upon some weird DC harmonics phenomenon.
At that point just by pass the offending system.
Take the factory low beam head light harness and slave it to power a relay, then wire your LED head lights to run through the relay via a fused wire coming off the battery or alternator. A 5 amp fuse will be more than enough to power the LEDs. Then fuse the factory low beam circuit with a 2 or 5 amps fuse, since the factory low beam circuit will only be powering a tiny relay at that point.

[elhigh]

I'm with Mark, I think the LED's power conditioning hardware (built into the base of the bulb) is sending some kind of interference up your wiring and you're hearing it in the switch itself.

Try cutting the ferrite choke knob off an unneeded computer cord, route out the cable from the middle of it, cut and splice your switch's wiring through that. If things improve, you may be on your way to fixing the problem. You might need to scope it to figure out exactly what frequency the PC system is generating so you can select the right kind of choke for your needs.

[some_other_dave]

Putting larger and larger fuses into the fuse holder means that at some point the wiring, or other electrical components, are going to become the fuse. If (e.g.) the wiring for a circuit is designed to carry 10A of current, and you put a 30A fuse in, a short circuit will allow 30A to flow through the wire. Which will heat up and melt, and possibly start a fire.

FIRE BAD!

So yeah, putting larger fuses in is definitely not the way to fix your problem. It sounds like the suggestions above should put you on your way to figuring out the actual problem and the way to fix it.

... Hmm, one extra thought. Did you replace any lights that are supposed to dim at the same time that you replaced the headlights? The dimmers on the LED lights in our house make the lights buzz. It's possible that there is something like that going on...

-soD

[OG VX]

^^ Yikes!

Switching back to 10A asap.

After further research, I suspect my fog light relay has gone to poop. I think that is what is making the buzzing noise. I'll report back here.

Thanks again, all, for your help and replies. This forum rocks.

[oil pan 4]

Rapidly cycling relay can make that sound, but its pretty rare.

[OG VX]

OK, so need some more help with this one.

Turns out the noise was coming from the fog relay. I found it under the dash. I replaced it with another relay from a local yard. No more buzzing sound, but the fogs still don't work. Anyone know of any other fuse in the Civic fog harness?

Also, I'm now leaning more towards the fact that the voltage may be so low that the car is having problems dicphering that they are actually on.

Another thing not to rule out is that the light stalk on the column is...finicky. I can (literally) jiggle the stalk while the headlights are in the "on" position, and watch the output/voltage of the lights flicker in intensity. Additionally, when I flick the stalk to the high position, the high beams will not stay lit there unless I hold the stock back in the position where you move the stalk to flash your highs. Weird stuff. Lots of dynamics on this one. Hard to diagnose. Urg.