Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > General Efficiency Discussion
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 10-28-2012, 08:52 PM   #1 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,527

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 54.46 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car Mirage - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 62.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,078
Thanked 6,976 Times in 3,612 Posts
Speed vs. MPG chart: 2002 Toyota Camry 2.4 auto (impressive highway MPG sleeper car?)



My parents have a 2002 Camry 2.4L 4-cylinder automatic.

I've never tested a car that gets such good highway MPG relative to its EPA rating. Can this car really beat its EPA highway rating at 75 mph?

Nearly 50 MPG when the torque converter locks in top gear? Amazing for such a big, gasoline car.




For reference, this car's EPA fuel economy ratings are:

EPA city: 21 mpg (US)
EPA highway: 29 mpg (US)
EPA combined: 24 mpg (US)

EPA "user average MPG" (22 users): 28.7 MPG

NRCan (Canadian) ratings:
City: 10.1 L/100 km (28 mpg Imp.)
Hwy: 6.9 L/100 km (41 mpg Imp.)

FYI, the ScanGauge was not calibrated to this car (by a fill-up), but I compared the SG to the car's onboard fuel economy display, and the SG read slightly worse than the factory gauge, which makes it more credible.

UPDATE: the SG was probably around 10% optimistic. See post #12 for details.

Weather conditions:

Oct 25, 2012
Sunny, 17 C
Wind SE 10 km/h (looked negligable at the test area on the water)
Pressure 101.7 kpa
Humidity 72%

Raw numbers:


km/h .... mph .... W MPGUS .... E MPGUS ... AVG. MPG (US) ... L/100 km

50 ... 31.1 ... 49 ... 51.1 ... 50.1 ... 4.7
60 ... 37.3 ... 48 ... 47.7 ... 47.9 ... 4.9
70 ... 43.5 ... 47.3 ... 51.9 ... 49.6 ... 4.7
80 ... 49.7 ... 47.4 ... 47 ... 47.2 ... 5.0
90 ... 55.9 ... 42.1 ... 41.8 ... 42.0 ... 5.6
100 .. 62.1 ... 37.1 ... 40.8 ... 39.0 ... 6.0
110 .. 68.4 ... 33.4 ... 33.5 ... 33.5 ... 7.0
120 .. 75 ......32.5 ... 32 ... 32.3 ... 7.3

Methodology:
Car was fully warmed up before the test.

Air conditioning was off, windows were up, headlights on.

Car was brought up to speed & leveled off before passing a "start" marker (road sign) where the computer was reset. Reading was taken after passing a "finish" marker.

Top gear/torque converter locks @ 70 km/h, so MPG reading taken at 72 km/h, to ensure it was locked.
Mods in place during test:
  • none
Route:
2 lane highway, straight, dry & level (follows river edge). The road runs SSW/NNE and can be found here: 1000 Islands Parkway - Google Maps . Test portion is 1.6 km / 1 mi in length.

Traffic conditions:
There was no traffic ahead in my lane; some traffic occasionally passed in the oncoming lane.
---

See also: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...you-15182.html

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	graph-speed-mpg-camry-2002.jpg
Views:	10473
Size:	48.5 KB
ID:	11747   Click image for larger version

Name:	2002-camry.jpg
Views:	4158
Size:	45.3 KB
ID:	11748  
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to MetroMPG For This Useful Post:
mikeyjd (04-01-2015)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 10-28-2012, 11:30 PM   #2 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
2000neon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 596

VX - '94 Honda Civic VX
Team Honda
90 day: 47.95 mpg (US)
Thanks: 133
Thanked 89 Times in 66 Posts
49.6 @ 45 mph, wow! I'm impressed. Tires pumped up, grill block, anything?
__________________

  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 10:44 AM   #3 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,527

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 54.46 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car Mirage - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 62.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,078
Thanked 6,976 Times in 3,612 Posts
Nada.

And that's with winter tires, mid-30's PSI. (Though we know winter tires don't necessarily have high rolling resistance.)
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 11:03 AM   #4 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
2000neon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 596

VX - '94 Honda Civic VX
Team Honda
90 day: 47.95 mpg (US)
Thanks: 133
Thanked 89 Times in 66 Posts
Wow, that's even more impressive. I always wondered what my Neon's instant as mileage was on the highway, instead of just tank-to-tank averages, and that's pretty close to were I figured it would be. It's surprising to think an even bigger car, with an even bigger motor and no aero mods could do the same. It's cool to see such an underrated car, it must "slip through the cracks" of the EPA test procedures and show worse than it really is. Although there are still probably people who only get 15 MPG out of them,

Looks like you lucked out doing it on the ONE nice fall day this year, If you're weather has been as brutal as it has here more towards Toronto/ KW area.
__________________

  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 11:14 AM   #5 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,527

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 54.46 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car Mirage - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 62.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,078
Thanked 6,976 Times in 3,612 Posts
It's really an eye-opener how different cars achieve their EPA highway rating at different cruising speeds. EG: with some, you can go well over 70 mph and still manage to get EPA MPG. With others, if you push past 60, you're already below EPA highway. (The Firefly is one of those, maddeningly: in stock form, if you cruise above 60 mph, you will not get the EPA highway MPG.)

---

Weather! Last Thurs/Fri we had two stunningly nice days. It was like late summer around here again! Temperature records broken. I went sailing
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 11:18 AM   #6 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,527

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 54.46 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car Mirage - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 62.14 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,078
Thanked 6,976 Times in 3,612 Posts
drag coefficient

Just looked this up:

2002 Camry drag coefficient = 0.28

That's decent.

According to 2 sources, including:
Toyota Camry 2.4 VVTi, 2002 technical specifications 141570
First Drive: 2002 Toyota Camry - Autos.ca
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 11:26 AM   #7 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Philippines
Posts: 2,173
Thanks: 1,739
Thanked 589 Times in 401 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG View Post
That's decent.
That's an understatement.

Whatever you feel about how Toyotas look, steer or accelerate, they have some amazingly good engines.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 05:37 PM   #8 (permalink)
Got MPG?
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Southern Alberta, Canada
Posts: 330

The Car - '09 Toyota Corolla CE Enhanced
Thanks: 13
Thanked 43 Times in 38 Posts
Top Gear did a review with the Corolla. They pit it against some of their favorite cars in the same class for handling, speed and comfort. the Corolla beat all of them in every category....except in looks.
__________________
2013 Honda Civic Si - 2.4L
OEM front to back belly pan from the factory.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 05:41 PM   #9 (permalink)
Hypermiler
 
PaleMelanesian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,321

PaleCivic (retired) - '96 Honda Civic DX Sedan
90 day: 69.2 mpg (US)

PaleFit - '09 Honda Fit Sport
Team Honda
Wagons
90 day: 44.06 mpg (US)
Thanks: 611
Thanked 433 Times in 283 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG View Post
It's really an eye-opener how different cars achieve their EPA highway rating at different cruising speeds. EG: with some, you can go well over 70 mph and still manage to get EPA MPG. With others, if you push past 60, you're already below EPA highway.
The difference is whether they worked to build a good car, or a car with good test scores. This is an example of the former.
__________________



11-mile commute: 100 mpg - - - Tank: 90.2 mpg / 1191 miles
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2012, 06:46 PM   #10 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 263

Winsight - '06 Honda Insight
Gen-1 Insights
90 day: 72.19 mpg (US)
Thanks: 244
Thanked 86 Times in 61 Posts
I agree, we have a 2002 2.4 auto as well. It doesn't really get used, but I was able to get to Cleveland on one tank and back home to Charlotte on one tank.

I did 5mph over the limit on the way up with one passenger, a couple dogs and around 100 pounds of cargo. Didn't air the tires up, so they were in the low 30s hot. It does have synthetic oil. The tires are cheaper General Tire all seasons in the stock size.

On the way back I aired the tired up to maximum, went the posted speed limit and had an additional 150lbs of cargo.

The result? Just under 16 gallons for 35mpg.
EPA ratings...

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	camry.JPG
Views:	181
Size:	81.2 KB
ID:	11763  
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to fusion210 For This Useful Post:
mikeyjd (04-01-2015)
Reply  Post New Thread






Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com