Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed
Register Now
 Register Now

Now available from EcoModder: ScanGauge II fuel economy gauge.  Click for details.  

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-18-2010, 12:01 PM   #11 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Illinois
Posts: 71
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 4 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbrowning View Post
I wonder what caused the hump in the curve for the Corolla? Aero? Surely it would have been in top gear before 60.
That top gear is at 43mph, I believe.

Found some more...

Assorted cars, including Yaris and Insight II by Consumer Reports, courtesy of MetroMPG (as with the Auto Bild chart)


  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 12:02 PM   #12 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Earth
Posts: 3,580
Thanks: 95
Thanked 426 Times in 308 Posts
I wish it was as simple as speed vs mpg for me. In the Insight, mpg is very noticably affected by things like temperature, winds (even light winds), road surface, & driver mood - yes, I do get better mpg when I'm happy about where I'm going. I haven't figured out the exact phase-of-the-moon vs mpg chart yet, but I'm sure it's there.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 12:27 PM   #13 (permalink)
Hypermiler
 
PaleMelanesian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,152

PaleCivic (retired) - '96 Honda Civic DX Sedan
90 day: 69.2 mpg (US)

PaleFit - '09 Honda Fit Sport
Team Honda
Wagons
90 day: 70.1 mpg (US)
Thanks: 408
Thanked 324 Times in 216 Posts
Here's another. My Odyssey, with the same drivetrain, predictably matches these results.

It also shows the bump when it shifts into top gear, like the Corolla above.

from Honda Ridgeline MPG vs speed graph: fuel economy with & without cargo trailer

__________________



11-mile commute: 100 mpg - - - Tank: 90.2 mpg / 1191 miles
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 12:29 PM   #14 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Kansas City, MO, USA
Posts: 38

Steve's Suzuki - '00 Suzuki Swift GA
Team Metro
90 day: 51.99 mpg (US)
Thanks: 5
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Lee View Post
About 1233 rpm @ 55 mph- jealous!

You would only get 1233rpm at 55mph if you forget to shift into 6th. Im jealous of the 1500rpm at 110mph! Those are some TALL gears.

36.5 mpg is very impressive for a 7.0 liter. Wow.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 01:02 PM   #15 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 239
Thanks: 0
Thanked 17 Times in 15 Posts
Some of those graphs show best mpg at very low speeds like the 2006 Toyota Corolla 1.6L Auto and vette . you think its in high gear at such low speeds or is it somehow getting better mpg not in high gear .
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 01:38 PM   #16 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
euromodder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Failed State Belgium
Posts: 4,344

GasDwarf - '13 Volkswagen up! EcoFuel CNG
Thanks: 141
Thanked 507 Times in 400 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbrowning View Post
I wonder what caused the hump in the curve for the Corolla? Aero? Surely it would have been in top gear before 60.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdKiefer View Post
you think its in high gear at such low speeds or is it somehow getting better mpg not in high gear .
I'm not surprised by it (only slightly so by the speed where it happens).

I have a hard time getting decent FE @ 90kph/56mph in 5th (top) gear, and it's the same with anything below 60kph/37mph in 4th.
The (smallish) engine revs low at these speed/gear combinations, barely 1600rpm.
I suspect it simply doesn't have the power to cope with the high loading.
A little bit faster, and it goes straight into its FE sweet spot around 100-105kph/62-65mph

Coming out of a deceleration phase and ending up in these situations, mpg will be OK. But any incline, or any attempt to accelerate will instantly result in a massive drop in mpg.
I've recently started to go back to 4th rather than stay in 5th, to come out of a tunnel on my commute and it seems mpg on the climb is better (or not as bad) in 4th.

I think I'm going to go ahead with an ECU remapping that gives more power and torque at lower revs.
I could use the odd extra 50 Nm around 1400-1600 rpm to bring the rpm down by 200-300 rpm - and drive in a higher gear.
As it is, the car needs a fair bit of throttle to get going smoothly.

HP and torque diagram of the Rica E-power remapping :
__________________
GasDwarf's fuel consumption :

Last edited by euromodder; 11-18-2010 at 01:44 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 02:37 PM   #17 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 239
Thanks: 0
Thanked 17 Times in 15 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by euromodder View Post
I'm not surprised by it (only slightly so by the speed where it happens).

I have a hard time getting decent FE @ 90kph/56mph in 5th (top) gear, and it's the same with anything below 60kph/37mph in 4th.
The (smallish) engine revs low at these speed/gear combinations, barely 1600rpm.
I suspect it simply doesn't have the power to cope with the high loading.
A little bit faster, and it goes straight into its FE sweet spot around 100-105kph/62-65mph

Coming out of a deceleration phase and ending up in these situations, mpg will be OK. But any incline, or any attempt to accelerate will instantly result in a massive drop in mpg.
I've recently started to go back to 4th rather than stay in 5th, to come out of a tunnel on my commute and it seems mpg on the climb is better (or not as bad) in 4th.

I think I'm going to go ahead with an ECU remapping that gives more power and torque at lower revs.
I could use the odd extra 50 Nm around 1400-1600 rpm to bring the rpm down by 200-300 rpm - and drive in a higher gear.
As it is, the car needs a fair bit of throttle to get going smoothly.

HP and torque diagram of the Rica E-power remapping :
right, I would assume somewhere around 40-50 mph would get best mpg as this would be approx speed of high gear . But in that first graph of 2006 Toyota Corolla 1.6L Auto it gets best at 24 mph, no way it is in high and as noted above the next bump is probably the high gear one .

I am just surprised it can get such good mpg, even besting high gear speeds .
If the engine is to small for gearing and weight, I would assume best would just move up on rpm scale, not go down in speed .Yes I realize most small engines peak there TQ at like 4-5k rpm which doesn't help real low rpm cruising .
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 03:16 PM   #18 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Illinois
Posts: 71
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 4 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdKiefer View Post
right, I would assume somewhere around 40-50 mph would get best mpg as this would be approx speed of high gear . But in that first graph of 2006 Toyota Corolla 1.6L Auto it gets best at 24 mph, no way it is in high and as noted above the next bump is probably the high gear one .

I am just surprised it can get such good mpg, even besting high gear speeds
Tested: speed vs MPG - 2006 Toyota Corolla automatic

MetroMPG talks about that here too. It would be interesting to find out just how many cars out there can achieve their best mpg just below top gear.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2010, 05:32 PM   #19 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 239
Thanks: 0
Thanked 17 Times in 15 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluejoey View Post
Tested: speed vs MPG - 2006 Toyota Corolla automatic

MetroMPG talks about that here too. It would be interesting to find out just how many cars out there can achieve their best mpg just below top gear.
That answer a lot of questions , thanks .
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2010, 07:52 PM   #20 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 16,761

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
90 day: 73.54 mpg (US)

ForkenSwift - '92 Geo Metro EV
Last 3: 95.68 mpg (US)

U.F.O. - retired - '00 Honda Insight
Team Honda
90 day: 88.21 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,045
Thanked 2,849 Times in 1,511 Posts
Good thread!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertSmalls View Post
We should all include the source of our data, so folks know how good the data is.
Yes, please! Links are also nice. I've added links to some of the posts above.

Quote:
Also, when Wayne Gerdes reviews a car, he does an mpg vs mph test on it.
That's excellent. Ideally, that kind of info would come with all car reviews. Or at least with reviews about so-called economy cars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Lee View Post
Periodically we get claims of higher fe at higher speeds, or at a certain speed range that isn't near the low end. I suppose it's possible if an engine has a peaky BSFC combined with certain gearing and loading... but most of the time I'm tempted to chalk those claims up to faulty fe calculating.
That's exactly why I wanted to do that Corvette Z06 test: to get some actual data to point to when that tired old line comes up.

__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread

Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The BSFC chart thread (post 'em if you got 'em) MetroMPG General Efficiency Discussion 249 09-04-2014 08:03 PM
EM Blog: GM engineers feel MPG gauges should be in all cars MetroMPG Instrumentation 2 10-24-2013 04:56 PM
2011 Ford Fiesta SFE (29 city / 40 hwy MPG US) Nels General Efficiency Discussion 68 11-29-2011 11:46 AM
Field Weakening Experiment for Speed Increase TomEV Fossil Fuel Free 12 04-10-2008 03:53 PM
EM Sticker contest #2: guess Mom's MPG! ('97 Camry 4-cyl auto) ends Sun., Feb. 3 MetroMPG Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed 33 02-04-2008 09:30 PM




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com