Hypermiling etiquette

[Galane]

There should be a sticky post on this to cover when you should NOT do some hypermiling techniques.

Doing whatever it takes to get the best MPG is all well and good, but when there's traffic on the road, especially on a two lane road, just pick a speed (preferably the speed limit) and stick with it.

Doing P&G and EOC where it's unsafe or impossible for people who want to go the speed limit to pass you is irresponsible and unsafe for you and other people with whom you are sharing the road.

A few more MPG isn't worth being the cause of a wreck* or someone getting so steamed they run you off the road and shoot you.

*One of those things the agencies which focus solely on "speed kills" never bother to study. How many head on collisions are caused not by speeders but by someone tooling along 10~15 MPH under the limit on a two lane road when people behind them go to pass so they can drive at the speed limit?

Something else to keep in mind is that in some US States (and likely in other countries) driving so slow as to be holding up traffic is illegal - though you're only likely to get a ticket for it if things have been real slow for other things the police can issue tickets.

Stay safe, stay legal, be aware of other drivers who don't care how efficient their driving is.

[svt98t]

I do agree with being aware of your surroundings. There are times and places for everything. Like today on the way to work. I drove the speed limit. The person behind me keep tailgating me. I have a 5.5 miles drive to work, she was behind me for about 3 miles of it.
The best part?
She was going to the exact place I was going. Ha.
Most people around, even on 2 lane roads, don't tailgate me while I'm doing the speed limit. They just hang back and chill. This was the first incident in a long time.

-ryan s.

[Frank Lee]

Motorists passing when they can't do it safely = their fault.

[Frank Lee]

Originally Posted by svt98t

I do agree with being aware of your surroundings. There are times and places for everything. Like today on the way to work. I drove the speed limit. The person behind me keep tailgating me. I have a 5.5 miles drive to work, she was behind me for about 3 miles of it.
The best part?
She was going to the exact place I was going. Ha.
Most people around, even on 2 lane roads, don't tailgate me while I'm doing the speed limit. They just hang back and chill. This was the first incident in a long time.

-ryan s.

Did she have a phone stuck to her head the whole time? Then she was lost in space; phone zombies find a rear bumper to latch onto when they fall into their driving comas.

[cbaber]

This topic is of great controversy here on ecoModder, as detailed in this thread: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...ate-26517.html

I'll offer a couple points. First, the perception of danger and safety is often subjective. For example, someone might believe going 5 under the speed limit on a 2 lane road is safe, while another might consider that a risk to head on collisions or traffic jams. There is no red line between MPG and safety. Each situation is different, every road is different, and every driver has their own limits and abilities. The only real standard to follow is the law. As long as the driver knows and follows the written rules, everything else is subjective. Common courtesy and respect for fellow drives is something I practice, but once again that is my own opinion and preference. For example, I would never go 15 under on a 2 lane highway with traffic, even though it is legal.

My second point is that every car on the road is responsible for their own actions. For you to say it's the slow drivers fault that a passing car created a head on collision while passing is just not true. The driver that chooses to pass is the one responsible for safely navigating and completing the pass. Unless the slow driver broke a law, they are not liable for other drivers' mistakes. And as easy as it is to blame the slow driver "forcing the other drivers to pass", no such thing happens. Slow drivers don't force people to pass, people want to pass slow people and choose to do so based on the desire to go a certain speed.

[user removed]

I've had people pass me crossing the double yellow line, in very dangerous curves, generally idiotic actions, and I was doing the speed limit, without variation.

I've had them pass me on the entrance ramp to the Interstate and I was doing the speed limit (they were not on the entrance ramp trying to get on the highway).

If slow speed causes a head on collision, then that same slow speed could result in serious injury, to you, when the car trying to pass you gets hit head on.

Tuesday I almost got in a wreck on my bike. A couple idiots in SUVs were passing each other and tailgating. One of them went by me at 70 in a 45 zone. I caught up with them at an intersection as I usually do when driving a road where I know the light timing perfectly. A couple intersections (with lights) down the road, an ambulance is approaching the intersection from a secondary road, lights but no sirens. Usually the ambulances here can switch the traffic light green but this did not happen this time. Two cars in front of me are at the intersection while the ambulance is not there quite yet.

The car in front of me suddenly locks his brakes, skids 25 feet and slams into the car in front of him and immediately stops (he was going 50 easy). I hit the brakes and felt the rear tire slide. I might have been able to stop, but decided to trade control for a panic stop, with the possiblilty of hitting the now smashed car and possibly getting sandwiched between the car behind me and the now wrecked one. I coasted between the two wrecked cars and another car in the left turn lane, through the intersection.

Most of my problem was the 2007 dated tires on my bike, probably less traction than when they were new, but they are not dry rotted and I hate to throw them away.
The two SUVidiots that had been passing-tailgating now had tow total loss junkers, and I survived.

As in most accidents there are multiple factors.
Had the ambulance not been there it never would have happened.
Had the first SUVidiot not slammed on his brakes it would never have happened.
Had the tailgater just driven normally (not agressively) it would have never happened.
Had I given him more separation I would not had to take the "control" option and illegally lane split between the twp groups of cars.

In the final analysis, I will give more distance between me and the car in front of me as my behavious modification, at least until I wear out those 6 year old tires.

The way you win driving is a lot like chess, stay intensely alert, give yourself some margin of error, and for me at least, consider everything going on around you as part of your "chess game".

regards
Mech

[user removed]

To make a point;

You're sitting at an intersection ( in spite of your best hypermiling and light timing), waiting for the red light to change. You look in your rearview mirror and a car is approaching very rapidly. You realize they can not stop in time to avoid hitting you hard!

What do you do?

A cop told me that the law required me to sit there and get hit. I told him there was no law that required me to allow someone to severely injure me. The cop might write me a ticket, but I have had 100% success when talking to the judge.

regards
Mech

[Galane]

Originally Posted by cbaber

For example, I would never go 15 under on a 2 lane highway with traffic, even though it is legal.

Except for where it isn't. http://www.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/e...tent_SPEED.htm

There's a bunch of PDFs with the sections on speed (too high and too slow) for all the US States. Nowhere have I found a compilation of all the State's minimum speed or impeding traffic laws or rules in an easy to read (ie where it's all on one page instead of having to download 50 separate files) format.

For example, here's the part in Idaho's law.

I. No person shall drive a motor vehicle at such slow speed as to impede the normal and reasonable movement of traffic except when reduced speed is necessary for safe operation or in compliance with the law. '49-655

Check your State's laws. It could save you a ticket from an officer who can't find anyone else to cite.

Excerpting all the "slowing" rules from those files into a single page would be a useful resource for Ecomodder.com

Most States also have a rule that on a more than 2 lane road drivers must move to the left lane and slow down for any emergency vehicle stopped at the side of the road, or must pull to the outside of the road and slow down or stop for a moving emergency vehicle. Curiously, the District of Columbia does not have such a law.

When I'm driving at the speed limit and some $#%& blows past me, I always wish for a cop hiding up ahead to nail them. Likewise when there's someone tottling along at 45 on 65 MPH two-lane US 95 I wish for a cop up ahead to nail them.

What is *extremely* annoying is a tailgater who refuses to pass when there's no safety reason to not pass so they can go speeding off to hopefully get a ticket. Many times I've had to pull over and stop to get some a-hole tailgater (about 99% of the time a full size pickup truck) to pass. About half the time the a-hole honks and yells all kinds of obscenities at me for ending their jerky fun.

From 1998 to 2000 I drove 156 miles from Weiser, ID to Grangeville, ID and back at least once almost every week. In all that time I saw ONE pickup truck pulled over and it was a small one. Full size pickups were apparently immune to any sort of traffic citation, even when I was going the limit and a pickup would blast past me at warp speed right in front of a State cop sitting by the road.

[doviatt]

And to the inevitable opposition to this attempted friendly thread....
Please post on the "I live to break the traffic laws" and the "Hold on, I'm on the phone" web sites some etiquette for their behaviors that also cause us and ALL OTHERS grief. The law is the law. Just because we here are willingly compliant and overtly safety conscious and economical and environmentally responsible shouldn't make us apologize or acquiesce to anyone.
As stated; it is a two way street. YOU pick which side you drive on.
In reality we all have to get along. When we don't good people die.

[Jasen]

It's only against the law if you get caught. From what I observe, that seem's to be many drivers mentality anyway.