Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > General Efficiency Discussion
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-10-2008, 02:21 PM   #11 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: 18603, USA
Posts: 759

The Crimson Crawler - '04 Hyundai Elantra GLS
90 day: 36.71 mpg (US)
Thanks: 221
Thanked 60 Times in 45 Posts
What about fuel temperature and engine temperature vs. MPG?

  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 12-10-2008, 04:02 PM   #12 (permalink)
38 time NHRA/IHRA Champ
 
ATaylorRacing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Fishers, IN
Posts: 305
Thanks: 1
Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts
Here's one that I am VERY interested in.....When coasting...with eith engine off or on..... how much less fuel is used when in neutral and the clutch is depressed compared to in neutral without the clutch being depressed. At the local speed shop we talked this over and came to the conclusion that there are less rotating parts in the tranny when the clutch is activated! This has to amount to some savings.....anyone out therer with a scan gauge want to let me in on the difference in their car?
__________________
42 time NHRA/IHRA drag race champ

05 SRT4-12.17@117 mph on DOTs-31.0 mpg-SOLD
96 Geo Metro-3 banger-60.1 mpg-SOLD
95 BMW M3-13.41 @ 106 mph-31mpg-SOLD
77 Chevy Monza with 350/350-FOR SALE
84 Horizon-1880 lbs-29 mpg
95 Neon-43 mpg
99 Z28-10.80 @ 127 mph-27.1mpg
2011 Prius-62.1 wife's
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2008, 05:33 PM   #13 (permalink)
Legend in my own mind
 
trikkonceptz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Homestead, Fl.
Posts: 927

Evil Pumpkin - '08 Scion xD RS 1.0 #1633
90 day: 35.45 mpg (US)

Silent Silver Killer - '10 Honda Insight EX
90 day: 51.5 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2
Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts
If the purpose of this is to get you into the school of engineering, then blow them away by writing a paper on camless engines utilizing an electronic valve setup allowing the cars computer to determine the most efficient timing and fuel usage based on conditions/driver input instead of one set method.

If you want to go for the A+ add to that a small electric motor that would attach to the front main pulley or attached to the fly wheel ala starter in order to restart the car by opening the valves to release compression, spinning the flywheel with the electric motor then start dumping spark and fuel into it to restart it. Basically a bump start, using an electric motor instead of a starter.

The advantage, you can keep the cam shaft rotating, perhaps while still injecting oil to keep the engine cool and still have systems like the a/c and alternator spinning and still working without burning any fuel.

Yes it is infinately more complicated than what I suggested, but thats why there are enginers out there like you and I ... LOL

GL ..
__________________
Thx NoCO2; "The biggest FE mod you can make is to adjust the nut behind the wheel"

I am a precisional instrument of speed and aeromatics
If your knees bent in the opposite direction......what would a chair look like???





  Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2008, 05:46 PM   #14 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,513

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.71 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 60.16 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,058
Thanked 6,957 Times in 3,602 Posts
I want you to dimple your entire car and write a kick-a$$ report about it so we can finally put that one to rest!

This is interesting. Looking forward to seeing which ones you choose.

Seriously: I'd like to see someone do a test of various simple air dam heights (ground clearances), holding all else constant, and see what you uncover. The results would be vehicle-specific, but still interesting. (Everyone else with a 6 would thank you though.)
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2008, 06:03 PM   #15 (permalink)
(:
 
Frank Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: up north
Posts: 12,762

Blue - '93 Ford Tempo
Last 3: 27.29 mpg (US)

F150 - '94 Ford F150 XLT 4x4
90 day: 18.5 mpg (US)

Sport Coupe - '92 Ford Tempo GL
Last 3: 69.62 mpg (US)

ShWing! - '82 honda gold wing Interstate
90 day: 33.65 mpg (US)

Moon Unit - '98 Mercury Sable LX Wagon
90 day: 21.24 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,585
Thanked 3,555 Times in 2,218 Posts
Do one on the placebo effect "fuel saving" devices have. Ex: have test drivers keep a gaslog for a statistically significant period, add a bogus device that really isn't even hooked up i.e. HHO with a plugged line, and watch the fe go up.
__________________


  Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2008, 06:08 PM   #16 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,513

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.71 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 60.16 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,058
Thanked 6,957 Times in 3,602 Posts
That's a great idea, Frank. The psych department would prob be more interested than the engineering people though!
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2008, 06:38 PM   #17 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: maine
Posts: 758

oldscoob - '87 subaru wagon gl/dr
90 day: 47.06 mpg (US)
Thanks: 21
Thanked 18 Times in 14 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by basslover911 View Post
I am going to try and transfer into MIT next school year and I need to do some research papers in order to hopefully get in. Since my major in engineering, and I plan on speciallizing on cars, I am going to do some experiments.

Here is what I have so far;
- Speed vs MPG (55, 65, and 75 mph)
- Aero Drag from Wheel Spoke Design (Using university wind tunnel)
- Tire PSI vs MPG (24, 34, 44 psi)
- Weight vs MPG (At constant speed i.e. highway driving)

What else would yall like to see now that I am at it?
ahh. schooling. MIT ...the original silicon valley.

California and....
where was I.

ahh. School. MIT.

A real experiment?...renew the actuality of natural aspiration with fuel and air mechanically. It was mastered more than once, very very perfected, nothing can beat it...and it was back shelfed to wehat I toihught was 3 feet tall and thieving in a horrifying language noone understands...(bad dream). anyway, Take injectors out of a fuel air system, but add the extras that keep the pleasant adjectives that go with the rest of electronic systems pleasant (heat risers, temp monitor balh blah blah.) One extreme to another, needs the brain of someone to bridge the real success. A singular carb metering with the help of electronics. It is so common sense and missing....
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2008, 12:11 PM   #18 (permalink)
EcoModding Dilatant
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 262

Volvo - '00 Volvo V70 XC AWD SE
90 day: 27.7 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4
Thanked 27 Times in 17 Posts
How about development of a liquid-drop airflow tracing method. i was thinking of trying this just for fun, but you are welcome to the idea.

I thought to coat the car's surface with a fine powder like flour or talc. It might be necessary to oil the surface first to get the powder to stick (although road dust seems to stick to my car quite well). Then, with the car at speed, use tubing to introduce a liquid at various points near the front of the car. The droplets would be swept back with the airflow, disturbing the powder and giving a clear semi-permanent indication of the streamlines.

That's more development of an experimental method rather than an experiment, but MIT might like that.

Also, I've often wondered if a flat plate extended a few feet in front of a car would act as a deflector to put the main body of the car in a low-pressure zone. Years ago I read about a similar technique used to improve ballistic missile range. I think the missile deflector changed the shockwave patterns and did just not deflect air, but it might work on cars at slower speeds, too.

Last edited by instarx; 12-16-2008 at 12:35 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2008, 01:22 PM   #19 (permalink)
Mech & Aero Engineer
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Garland, Texas
Posts: 28
Thanks: 0
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
MIT has done some research on adding hydrogen to the fuel mixture within an engine in order to improve emissions. The hydrogen is made by using an electric arc to pyrolyze a little of the hydrocarbon fuel. I performed some arc-pyrolysis experiments, but I was using more power in electricity that what could be obtained from the hydrogen that was produced. However, there are other arc/plasma devices out there that could do the pyrolysis much more efficiently, such as GlidArc, Kaevner, and Huels. Look-up my papers and dissertation at Publications for more information. If you want to tackle the topic of on-board pyrolysis as a way of implementing a hydrogen-fueled vehicle - stick to paper research (experiments will set you way too far back in time and expense). See what devices are out there and how much energy they consume to produce hydrogen. The hydrogen could be burned in an engine or go to a fuel cell.
If you are really keen on doing an experiment with a car, I would recommend surveying the temperature distribution in the engine compartment and/or the vehicle underside. You could order some temperature indicators from omega.com (lacquer, crayons, adhesive dots or strips) apply them to your car and then take photos to see what temperatures were exceed where. Heat tends to kill the electronics that are under the hood and I have heard anecdotes about gas tanks getting excessively hot. Look-up SAE paper 910307 Williams, Oler, Hackett, Hammar "Water Flow Simulation of Automotive Underhood airflow Phenomena" for some background research. There are probably more good papers since '91 that I am not aware of.
Finally, try to check MIT out to see if it is really the right environment for you. I don't know about MIT, but some departments with big reputations really don't give a crap about undergrads (or perhaps even grad students). As long as they got people clamoring to get in, they would just as soon flunk you as look at you.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2008, 07:02 AM   #20 (permalink)
EcoModding Dilatant
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 262

Volvo - '00 Volvo V70 XC AWD SE
90 day: 27.7 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4
Thanked 27 Times in 17 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmroseberry View Post
Finally, try to check MIT out to see if it is really the right environment for you. I don't know about MIT, but some departments with big reputations really don't give a crap about undergrads (or perhaps even grad students). As long as they got people clamoring to get in, they would just as soon flunk you as look at you.
I think that is a little pessimistic. It wasn't MIT, but my grad school program (Environmental Sciences and Engineering) has 3,000 applicants each year and only accepts 12 students, and they treated us very well. It is to any school's advantage to graduate as many of their students as possible. I know several MIT grads (both undergrad and graduate degrees) and I got the impression they all loved it there.


Last edited by instarx; 12-17-2008 at 07:08 AM..
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mini experiments: 300w vs. 800w block heater warm up time MetroMPG EcoModding Central 73 06-15-2014 03:30 PM
Traffic experiments: a cure for waves and jams (improves other people's MPG too) MetroMPG Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed 13 01-20-2008 09:35 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com