Why no diesel Prius?

[Cobb]

If you want to improve the mpg of a prius, just do what yall tell newbies to do. Ive done a lot fo my Insight which looks similar in shape t a prius and its helped me almost double the epa. As I tell newbies on the Insightcentral site, adjust the nut behind the steering wheel for better mpg.

The prius 3 I drove wasnt smooth. It felt like I had a 12,000 btu window air conditioner under the hood when the gas engine fired up. Then when above highways speeds I had a leaf blower sound come and go from the rear seats.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by euromodder

It'd not return the investment - once you're already in Prius MPG territory, you're also in low-return-on-investment territory. It uses so little, that it's hard to get any gains.

If I would ever get a Prius and slap a Diesel into it, actually, the payback wouldn't be my major concern. I'd do it because I enjoy some redneck-engineering

I can only tell diesels are NOT the solution, however attractive they may seem to US drivers.
You guys only see the inflated MPG numbers.

Diesels seem attractive to me not just due to the high MPG, but also due to the adaptability to alternative fuels. That's actually the main reason leading me towards Diesel engines

[Piwoslaw]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

Diesels seem attractive to me not just due to the high MPG, but also due to the adaptability to alternative fuels.

Older diesels can run on just about anything, but newer turbodiesels with commonrail may be too delicate to run on anything but what they were designed for.

[Cobb]

Myself and Dax have proven that to get more mpg and performance out of a hybrid you jsut need to back feed the battery pack to the hybrid system. Why reinvent the wheel when you can just add MORE POWER?????

Lets say you go the die-sel route. Are you going to use the power splitter or supply your own tranny? Since its an E-CVT you need the synergy drive system for it to work properly unless you use a cvt from a Honda or some other vehicle.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by Piwoslaw

Older diesels can run on just about anything, but newer turbodiesels with commonrail may be too delicate to run on anything but what they were designed for.

Newer common-rail setups are really not so die-hard as the old all-mechanical ones, and would require some electronic tuning, but it also opens a wide way to enjoy the most efficient injection timing for each fuel in case of a multifuel capability

[euromodder]

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

Diesels seem attractive to me not just due to the high MPG, but also due to the adaptability to alternative fuels. That's actually the main reason leading me towards Diesel engines

That's for old-skool diesels.

The very delicate current "high efficiency" crop can't handle alternative diesel-like fuels anymore.
Heck, mine has trouble with the mere 5% bio-diesel in our regular diesel ...
Especially the after-treatment systems are trouble-prone.
Today's injectors will have trouble with even the smallest impurities in the fuel.
So will the high pressure pumps.

How many common-rail diesels do you know that run veggie oils ?
How many of those have a diesel particulate filter ? - not that these do any good, on the contrary, but they're mandatory regardless.

[Arragonis]

Don't modern ones use a lot of the fuel to lubricate stuff where normal oil would probably struggle to be kept out of the combustion process ?

[GreenHornet]

Originally Posted by euromodder

That's for old-skool diesels.

The very delicate current "high efficiency" crop can't handle alternative diesel-like fuels anymore.
Heck, mine has trouble with the mere 5% bio-diesel in our regular diesel ...
Especially the after-treatment systems are trouble-prone.
Today's injectors will have trouble with even the smallest impurities in the fuel.
So will the high pressure pumps.

How many common-rail diesels do you know that run veggie oils ?
How many of those have a diesel particulate filter ? - not that these do any good, on the contrary, but they're mandatory regardless.

Euromodder,

You are correct on this common rails can not handle the biodiesel due to the injectors and high pressure pumps. To me that is the biggest negative to them despite being more efficient than there IDI cousins.

The alternative is the M-TDI you get the best of both worlds! Then to cut the pollution factor just utilize a water/methanol injection system. The M-TDI you will see on the 1.9L and 1.6L TD. They are a hybrid design and work great. They are popular with conversions and dune buggies since there is no need for all the electronic control stuff! The 1.6L TD eco was very fuel efficient and can be had for minimal cost used. The M-TDI would be very useful in this engine and would boost efficiency. Put this engine into the right low mass vehicle get it loaded properly and you have a vehicle capable of some great MPG numbers with reasonable performance.

[GreenHornet]

Originally Posted by Cobb

Myself and Dax have proven that to get more mpg and performance out of a hybrid you jsut need to back feed the battery pack to the hybrid system. Why reinvent the wheel when you can just add MORE POWER?????

Lets say you go the die-sel route. Are you going to use the power splitter or supply your own tranny? Since its an E-CVT you need the synergy drive system for it to work properly unless you use a cvt from a Honda or some other vehicle.

The Honda CVT is electronically controlled so you would still have to sort out that potential problem area! It could be done but there would be some real work to do to get it to work correctly.

That is a problem these days everything is controlled by ECU and every car has different ECU. There are definitely pros to the modern ECU don't get me wrong but when it comes to building your own hybrid or swapping parts from various vehicle platforms it often becomes more cost and work than what its worth in output gains.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by euromodder

The very delicate current "high efficiency" crop can't handle alternative diesel-like fuels anymore.
Heck, mine has trouble with the mere 5% bio-diesel in our regular diesel ...
Especially the after-treatment systems are trouble-prone.

After-treatment systems became really over-complicated, at a certain point that some Diesel users and enthusiasts started to question their real effectiveness regarding the overall operational footprint of a vehicle fitted with them.
workaround ideas to discuss among friends: Arguments against EPA witch-hunting regarding Diesels without mandatory emissions equipment

Today's injectors will have trouble with even the smallest impurities in the fuel.
So will the high pressure pumps.

That's why many WVO conversion kits have filters.

How many common-rail diesels do you know that run veggie oils ?
How many of those have a diesel particulate filter ? - not that these do any good, on the contrary, but they're mandatory regardless.

Volkswagen TDI and some French engines, most notably from Renault, still work reasonably with vegetable oil conversions. I know it's illegal, but some actually have the DPF removed and the EGR bypassed to work better with vegetable oil...