12 cent federal gas tax increase coming?

[bhtooefr]

Also, a large portion of road funding comes from sources other than fuel taxation and other fees on usage of the road: Gasoline Taxes and Tolls Pay for Only a Third of State & Local Road Spending | Tax Foundation

Plus, NONE of the cost of fuel goes to taking care of the environmental costs of fuel usage, in the US, or the health costs that result from the environmental damage. There's a lot of negative externalities that European fuel taxation internalizes.

[Hersbird]

Originally Posted by Fat Charlie

I'm a big fan of higher gas taxes, sort of along the lines of "stupid should hurt." Fuel efficient vehicles should be encouraged as a matter of policy by making inefficiency cost more and letting the marketplace figure things out.

More fuel efficient vehicles directly add less pollution to the air and less wear and tear to the roads. Indirectly they cause fewer fuel tanker runs to their local stations (meaning that much less pollution and wear & tear). As an added bonus, smaller vehicles isolate the driver less from the outside world, promoting greater awareness. The perceived feeling of "danger" some people feel in smaller cars is really just awareness, and more of that leads directly to safer operation. Indirectly, when smaller cars do crash, they cause less damage to bystanders, telephone poles and other things near the road.

Indirect costs like increased freight expenses will end up shifting freight prices and maybe changing ordering behavior- maybe Amazon Prime will charge a couple more bucks to overnight things.

"Stupid should hurt", and "letting the marketplace sort it out" are direct opposites. The marketplace will make stupid hurt if you keep government out of it. Taxing something to make something hurt but not something else leads to the worst stupidity of all. If stupid should hurt they should close Washington all together.

[fusion210]

Originally Posted by cowmeat

We can all counteract the rising gas prices, that's why we're on this site in the first place.

It works great on a small scale, but when they notice tax revenue dropping from people being more efficient, up go the taxes.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

I'm not sure about this, in NorCal the roads are filled with potholes, and the one time I went to Texas the potholes were 2x as big. We don't even have snow and its associated problems.

I assume 'NorCal' = Northern California? Then what do you mean, you don't have snow? Maybe not often down in the flatland parts, but get up in the Sierras and you get a bunch of it. And associated problems: a few years ago, if I drove I-80 over Donner Summit, I would seriously worry about high-centering the Insight on the ruts trucks and cars with tire chains had worn into the concrete.

[Fat Charlie]

Basic regulation is in no way the direct opposite of a free market. Allowing people to ignore actual costs of their actions, especially costs that don't affect them personally, is a bad thing. That kind of stuff is one of the main things governments exist to prevent.

Environmental regulations are a great example- remember when industrial areas' pollution was causing acid rain downwind? You can't put a price on a lake full of dead fish, but you can change the market's ground rules by limiting industrial emissions. Consumer safety laws are another good example: the government will not allow you to sell a car that does not have certain safety features or is otherwise inherently dangerous. When dangerous flaws come to light after the fact, the government can force a recall. One might see that as needless tyranny or a creeping nanny state, or one can see it as a set of basic ground rules that allow a market to flourish- regular people can buy cars without being mechanical and electrical engineers or having a private army that can strike fear into GM's heart.

Reliable ground rules let people better calculate consequences and make decisions, which is good for markets. Taxing gasoline is a more market based approach than simply banning behavior: you're still allowed to burn all the gas you want, but it's going to be expensive. Are you sure you don't want to rethink driving your Humscalade everywhere? A nice little Kia will get you there for 1/10 the cost. But if rolling in a couple tons of steel is that important to you, go for it. And while you're adding more wear and tear to our roads than the little roller skate drivers, you can pay for that too.

[Hersbird]

Now you use public saftey regulations in your argument when in the pervious post you say the large SUVs are causing people to drive with more abandon when it comes to saftey. Seems to me those same public saftey regulations put on cars do the same thing except with the SUV it's the free market and with airbags, tire pressure monitoring, double absorbing guard rails, back up cameras, etc, cause the same perception of saftey. If you think stupid should be painful you should be against ALL regulations and policies designed to isolate stupid from the consequences not just the ones that fit one side of politics.

[Fat Charlie]

Huh?

I'm actually not in favor of airbags, seatbelt/helmet laws, TPMS and backup camera requirements and the like. Personal choice is great when the main consequences are limited to you.

But I'm on the road with those oversized unmaneuverable boats and don't really care if they die because of their stupidity, I just don't want them taking me or anyone else out with them. I would like rules to isolate me from their stupid.

I just don't feel like having to be Mad Max in order to commute. It's not really a political position.

[gone-ot]

...sorry, but IMHO giving the Gooberment MORE money and expecting ANYTHING in return is nothing more than a "Fool's Errand."

[cowmeat]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

Or ride a bike (last tank 84MPG) and have fun.

regards
Mech

Every time I think about getting a bike, another biker in my area gets creamed. Just the other day an 80 year old man pulled straight into the path of a biker who was doing at least 60, about a block from my house. The memorial full of flowers, teddy bears and crosses reminds me why a bike isn't practical in my area.

[Hersbird]

An 80 year old turned in front of a bike here too, same thing, cross, flowers, teddy bears. Difference the bike was doing over 100 in a 35. Killed the guy's wife in the passenger seat as well.
Then last year I'm driving along going 20 behind a motorcycle when off from the side a kid on a BMX bike trays to cross traffic and side swipes the motorcycle sending him over high side! Even bicyclists have trouble seeing motorcycles apparently. I want a 70's Japanese bike also just to customize and ride to work in the summer, but I also have a family to support.