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Old 10-20-2019, 12:11 AM   #11 (permalink)
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To all the hydrogen fan boys:
How much do you think hydrogen is going to cost?
Free.
Less than electric.
Less than a gasoline in a hybrid.
Between electric and gasoline.
More than gasoline.

What do ya think?

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Old 10-21-2019, 12:18 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Isn't it lease-only?
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Old 10-21-2019, 09:33 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Xist View Post
Isn't it lease-only?
If you really want to you can buy one, like EV owners nobody does buy a new example.
.

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...5372/overview/


Via auction you can get a 2016 Mirai for around $5000, or $15,000 retail with $15000 of free fuel

These cars have an excellent EV drivetrain and would make a great EV conversion
A Mirai otherwise is nothing more than a repackaged Lexus HS (which failedin the market) and could likely accept a drivetrain swap from a Prime or Lexus with some effort, sadly they are big heavy cars even with the hydrogen bits removed so not real interesting

Fellow Mirai owners are actually complaining that too many people are buying them now that used examples are for sale.

Peruse the Mirai forum if you want a laugh
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Old 10-21-2019, 02:09 PM   #14 (permalink)
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It goes way beyond the cost of the hydrogen from electrolysis, or even from steam reformed natural gas. It is very high priced - $10-15 / KG which is equivalent to a gallon of gas in terms of energy.

It is the cost of building the filling stations and the infrastructure to supply them. They cost about $2 Million each, and they can fill about 15 cars per day.

In the area around LA, which is where most of the hydrogen filling stations in the US are - they have had a LOT of problems with supply, and very often, they can only fill cars to about 5,000PSI. Which is about half the usual pressure - so you only get about half the range.

Since there are only stations in a limited area, you can only drive (less than) half of the range away, so you can make it back.

South Korea is also struggling to get FCEVs rolling. Who wants to buy a car than you can't drive? Who wants to build filling stations, when there are so few cars? Which side of the equation has to go first, so to speak?
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Old 10-21-2019, 06:29 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard View Post
South Korea is also struggling to get FCEVs rolling. Who wants to buy a car than you can't drive? Who wants to build filling stations, when there are so few cars? Which side of the equation has to go first, so to speak?
FCEVs are a much greater departure from gasoline than other alternate fuels such as ethanol and CNG, which are also much easier to store than hydrogen. It's impossible to not compare FCEVs to ethanol-capable flexfuel cars and the CNG conversions, which required not only a previous effort to increase their availability but also competitive prices in order to attract ordinary customers in countries where such options are more widely accepted.
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Old 10-21-2019, 07:02 PM   #16 (permalink)
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I already know how much it will cost. I wanted to see what the hydrogen groupies think.

That's sad I don't have any problem filling my leaf up all the way, at home and for almost nothing.

Hydrogen cars are stupid.

Here is my personal charging network. One more has been added since I took this pic.
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1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.

Last edited by oil pan 4; 10-21-2019 at 07:29 PM..
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Old 10-21-2019, 11:49 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Hydrogen cars are dead. Put bigger batteries in 'em and add a plug.
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Old 10-22-2019, 12:39 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Hydrogen cars were always doomed to be dead on arrival.
They had a chance when fuel cells looked like they maybe could be the future, then along came lithium batteries and made them obsolete for most if not all terrestrial ground based, mobile applications.
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1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
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Old 10-22-2019, 02:36 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard View Post
Hydrogen cars are dead. Put bigger batteries in 'em and add a plug.
Wait a bit and you might be able to

2016 Mirais are only $5000 through auction.

I havenít gotten word if the Mirai would pay the EV tax from the state dmv, if it doesnít everything but the battery is there to do an OEM conversion to a Bev.

My guess is if hydrogen supply issues continue and cars age they might get cheap enough as used sheetmetal to justify for new BEV conversion

Maybe the hydrogen tank would make a good cng tank.
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Old 10-22-2019, 03:20 PM   #20 (permalink)
EV convert
 
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
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Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 124.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 180
Thanked 2,524 Times in 1,971 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmay635703 View Post
Wait a bit and you might be able to

2016 Mirais are only $5000 through auction.

I havenít gotten word if the Mirai would pay the EV tax from the state dmv, if it doesnít everything but the battery is there to do an OEM conversion to a Bev.

My guess is if hydrogen supply issues continue and cars age they might get cheap enough as used sheetmetal to justify for new BEV conversion

Maybe the hydrogen tank would make a good cng tank.
The hydrogen tank wouldn't make a good cng tank.
It would make a great cng tank for automotive use.
It's already approved to be used as a vehicle fuel tank.
It's already designed to fit under a vehicle and they fill to over 5,000psi. 5,000psi is the lowest psi I have heard of I think they could go as high as 10,000psi.

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1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
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