Civic - Bad in the snow?

[Christ]

Tire Tech Information - Where to Install New Pairs of Tires?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxY8C...layer_embedded

Putting new tires on car's rear not a scam
Goodyear Tires | Support | FAQs | Care
Michelin - Fitting tyres - Why fit new or less worn tyres to the rear?

[Christ]

It's not just hydroplaning. It's easier to control understeer than oversteer, period.

If you're understeering, you'll instinctively attempt to slow down. It's the first thing that 95% of drivers will do. By doing so, you're putting more weight on the steer tires, adding traction to them.

You want better traction on the rear, regardless of driveline, since the rear will be more prone to lose traction under braking/turning conditions.

This is not a new concept.

Back to my game, now.

[Frank Lee]

Good flick. Everyone else, do that.

[Christ]

Originally Posted by Frank Lee

Guess I'm too old-school to change in that department. I believe motorists should be able to handle oversteer- and that's decidedly old-school. Anyway, when I die in a flaming wreck on the far side of that turn (there is only one turn in N.D.) my last thought will be "Christ! Why didn't I listen to Christ!"

I actually agree with this, and took 50 hours of high-speed driving classes as a result, before I even had my permit for street-operation.

I basically wanted to make every attempt to be prepared for an accident situation before getting into one, and not just "poke and hope" for the correct outcome.

The high-speed training has probably saved my life a few times. Inversely, it's probably part of the reason I used to drive so fast. "I was trained to do it, so I can do it safely." Which is not necessarily true.

Anyway, as a result of those classes, and life in general, I've learned to expect oversteer far sooner than understeer in most conditions, and correct for it accordingly. I drive slow enough anymore that even if I slide ass-first into someone's yard, I won't go past the mailbox strip.

I think responsibility and attention to the nuances of foul-weather driving should be more important than what axle your tires are on. But, I'm far from average, as are you, Frank.

[tasdrouille]

There's no point in keeping the rear from swapping places with the front end when I'm braking at the bottom of a hill i I can't get up the hill in the first place.

Personally, having no choice, I'd put the good one in front, but I'd drive accordingly.

But really, I'd put 4 new tires.

[dcb]

I get what you are trying to say Christ, but there are some discrepancies with the video

@ 1:45 the blue car turns the tires in (and is also making a tighter turn than white )
@ 2:03 the blue car swerves then turns tires in.

[MazdaMatt]

It is amazing how many drivers know better than everyone else. Ya know... 93% of drivers are better than average!

[hamsterpower]

re: older Civics being worse. I'd bet that in that case the rear lower trailing arm bushing was worn out. This will cause the outer rear tire to slightly fold over and ride the edge while cornering. This is very common in older Hondas and others no doubt. Most reviews I have read of post 2001 Civics is the handling is worse because of the strut style suspension.

re: a lowered Civic in the snow. This also often messes up the camber causing unpredictable handling. Civics really need a good camber kit when lowered.

re: the video. Anyone notice how in most of the shots of the blue car spinning that the driver had turned sharply in to cause an exaggerated rotation? I think the real moral of that film is we all need to get BMWs with big wings and racing stripes. hehehe.

[Christ]

LOL - I didn't actually watch the video, I pulled it from another forum site at random, because they're all basically the same.

fact is, NHTSA and large tire manufacturers still recommend that the new tires be put on the rear, regardless of drivetrain, or claimed experience of the driver.

The other fact, is that the insurance companies of most garages that I've seen locally and abroad (outside of PA) REQUIRE they be put on the back, for sustained coverage against liability. It's become a legal issue for a garage to not put them on the back because of the recommendation.

I'm not saying that you guys should do one thing or another, but I am saying that if you feel you have the driving skills to do opposite what those "in the know" are telling you to do, then don't complain when the same thing they told you would happen, does happen.

That said, I never really pay attention to where my new tires are versus my old ones. I change them with a bumper jack and two tire irons, and they hardly ever get balanced. Take THAT! tire manufacturers!

Oh - I had put a complete urethane bushing set in my Civic before that winter, and replaced the rear TA bushings with nylon donuts so they didn't wear out/break again, so no, that wasn't the reason for it being bad in the snow. It was just bad.

[rkcarguy]

It's all tires for the most part. My wifes Civic has pretty new all seasons on it and it's about as good in the snow as my F350 in 4x4 which is due for tires soon.
If it still sucks, and being this is the eco-modder forum, deflate them tires down about 2/3rds the max pressure.
Lastly, check your tire make/model on the tire rack site for reviews.
When there's a N/A in the snow and ice catagory they mean it. I've gotten stuck in snow with new hi-po Yokohama's and they were worthless.