The climate change consensus extends beyond climate scientists

[freebeard]

...a juggling act for which there is no market driven answer.

Would you settle for a crypto-currency driven answer?

https://www.factom.com/

https://www.ethereum.org/

[NeilBlanchard]

Originally Posted by sendler

Sorry. I couldn't disagree more. Let's run the numbers.
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Let’s Run the Numbers – Nuclear Energy vs. Wind and Solar | The Energy Reality Project
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Why then is wind and solar are growing so quickly? Texas and Iowa are leading the way in wind power for a reason. Solar pays for itself in about 10 years - without incentives.

Solutions Project

The true cost of nuclear is only now coming due, with the first 5 plants beginning to be decommissioned. What are we going to do with the nuclear waste? Who will pay for that?

[roosterk0031]

Because tax payers are paying all of wind installation cost. Mid American Energy's CEO was asked on the radio after announcing a 3.6 billion dollar wind farm and stated that it cost them nothing, tax payer cover it all. Simon Conway WHO 1040 radio interview, probably could find the clip on face book.

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

The true cost of nuclear is only now coming due, with the first 5 plants beginning to be decommissioned. What are we going to do with the nuclear waste? Who will pay for that?

The US no longer recycles nuclear waste thanks to fear and ignorance.
Now it looks like the tax payers will pay for disposal. If the waste were recycled the user would pay for it.
Originally this problem did not exist, it was created.

[freebeard]

Originally this problem did not exist, it was created.

Quoted For Truth.

How can the Powers that Be depopulate the planet without a War on Carbon?

[ThermionicScott]

Originally Posted by freebeard

How can the Powers that Be depopulate the planet without a War on Carbon?

Which "powers that be" are out to "depopulate the planet"? Sources, please.

[sendler]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

Why then is wind and solar are growing so quickly? Texas and Iowa are leading the way in wind power for a reason. Solar pays for itself in about 10 years - without incentives.

It's easy to be swept up by the enthusiasm. Solar and wind can help. But just looking at your electric bill of a very thrifty home only shows a fraction of the energy that each person is using. Each of us relies on schools, hospitals, police forces, governments, infrastructure such as roads water and sewer. ect, ect, ect. Our energy consumption is immense. Look it up. We have huge megalopolises. We must be pragmatic. Solar and wind with baseload level storage will not be dense enough, soon enough. We have 150 years to quadruple the current world energy output. At least. And then add in multipliers for the transitioning of all agriculture and heavy transportation in that time frame when the crude oil is gone. And 100 years thereafter to transition all heat when the last of the gas is sucked dry. Good luck without using our second primordial gift of nuclear fuel. Anyone that really thinks the starving hoards of the future will leave this resource untapped is fooling themselves. If we drag our feet too long it will be too late and we will be caught in an energy trap where we don't have the resources to pull of any further transition. It has already been way too long. These plants that we are still using were designed by guys with pencils and slide rules. We can do much better now.

[freebeard]

Originally Posted by ThermionicScott

Which "powers that be" are out to "depopulate the planet"? Sources, please.

The first victim of Political Correctness is humor. The frame was Hegelian Conflict Resolution. And it should have been 'Carbon-based life forms.'

That rabbit-hole is pretty darned deep. Sure you wouldn't rather talk about the Sekrut Space Program?

We have 150 years to quadruple the current world energy output. At least. And then add in multipliers...

Or, contrary-wise, we have 150 years to quarter the inefficiencies in society.

“True wealth is the already accomplished organization of human capabilities to clothe, shelter, feed, protect, inform and accommodate the initiatives of human life. The magnitude of true wealth consists of the number of forward days of the number of human beings already provided for.”

From R. Buckminster Fuller’s Operating Manual for Spaceship Earth.

http://petekistler.com/quote-of-the-month/

“We should do away with the absolutely specious notion that everybody has to earn a living. It is a fact today that one in ten thousand of us can make a technological breakthrough capable of supporting all the rest. The youth of today are absolutely right in recognizing this nonsense of earning a living. We keep inventing jobs because of this false idea that everybody has to be employed at some kind of drudgery because, according to Malthusian Darwinian theory he must justify his right to exist. So we have inspectors of inspectors and people making instruments for inspectors to inspect inspectors. The true business of people should be to go back to school and think about whatever it was they were thinking about before somebody came along and told them they had to earn a living.”

Good Reads: Quote by Buckminster Fuller

[sendler]

This guy is sharp. Too bad he went dark a few years ago. Do the math.
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https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2011/10/the-energy-trap/
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https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/post-index/
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[freebeard]

Bucky went dark in 1989. If the trajectory had altered in 1970, the year he estimated humankind first had the intellectual capital to survive, we'd be in a different state today.

As it is, those ROI estimates from 2011 are being superceded by things like foil roll-to-roll-manufactured solar cells.

OTOH, his Synergetics describes the ground rules for nano-scale structures. People will be studying it whole decades from now.