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Old 10-05-2016, 12:47 PM   #11 (permalink)
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MPG showdown! Civic hybrid vs. Mirage sedan



My parents have a 2009 Honda Civic hybrid. (Doh: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...nst-28842.html )

The Civic hybrid (CVT only) is EPA rated at:
- 40 city
- 45 hwy
- 42 combined

The Mirage sedan (CVT) is EPA rated at:
- 35 city
- 42 hwy
- 37 combined

My dad and I did a quick 'n' dirty, non-scientific comparison between the two cars:

Route details:

- sub/urban driving
- both cars warm but not hot (driven within the previous few hours)
- weather warm (~70 F / 21 C) & dry
- 2 traffic lights (red each time); 8 stop signs; no impeding traffic to speak of
- 20 minutes round trip

The test:

- B
oth cars were driven at the same rates of acceleration (I followed). A/C was off.
- The Mirage was not close enough to benefit from the Civic's draft
- To level the playing field with the Civic engine "auto-stop" feature, I turned off the Mirage's engine when I'd be stopped for more than ~5 seconds.

Results:



Civic hybrid: 35.7 mpg US
Mirage sedan: 39.3 mpg US

Those are uncalibrated gauges. So take it with a grain of salt! (The last Mirage I had, its gauge was ~5% optimistic. I've never checked the accuracy of this Civic's MPG gauge.) So, effectively a tie?



What's most interesting to me is the Mirage easily outperformed its EPA rating, where the Civic underperformed its. This is consistent with what Mirage owners are seeing.

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Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



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Old 10-05-2016, 01:43 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 50.45 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 69.74 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,425
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Oh, and on a related note, my 80+ year old dad actually preferred riding in the Mirage over his Civic:

- The Civic sits noticeably lower than the Mirage, making it harder for him (with his creaky back) to get in & out
- The Mirage's suspension is tuned more for comfort than handling. His back prefers comfort these days.

Both of these cars are remarkably quiet to drive in when driven lightly to moderately, because their CVT's are programmed for economy, with surprisingly low engine RPM. On the other hand, because they both have small engines and snowmobile transmissions, they get downright raucous when you want fast acceleration.

I also think the Mirage's CVT drives better than the Honda's. The Civic's is lurchy, rubber-bandy, and inconsistent.

Why he bought that Civic I'll never be sure.
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Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



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Old 10-05-2016, 04:39 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Old 10-05-2016, 04:44 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

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90 day: 50.45 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
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Thanks. Re-uploaded - how about now?
__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



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has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
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Old 10-07-2016, 11:56 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 50.45 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 69.74 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,425
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First fill-up

Fill-up results:

52.4 mpg US = 4.5 L/100 km (calculated). Onboard gauge said 50.1 mpg.



Distance & driving style details:


690.6 km / 429 miles

51% = rural highway (80 km/h ~ 50 mph limit)
9% = freeway (100 km/h ~ 60 mph limit)
40% = sub/urban

Driving style: laid back, but not hard-core hypermiling by any stretch of the imagination:

Highway: cruise control at (or a couple over) the posted limit.

Sub/urban: mild acceleration (<2k RPM); reading traffic well ahead to avoid rushing in to avoidable braking situations; minimal idling.
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__________________
Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



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Old 10-07-2016, 12:08 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Anybody know the best deal possible on one of these but with a manual? You could get the previous generation for $10,000 some places. Did the price go up a bunch with the redesign?
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Old 10-07-2016, 12:14 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

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90 day: 50.45 mpg (US)

Winter beater Metro - '00 Chevrolet Metro
90 day: 69.74 mpg (US)
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Hatch or sedan?

They were blowing out the base 2015 hatchbacks at $9-10k USD in the spring with a hefty factory discount. If you can still find a new 2015 hatch around, I'm sure the price would be in the same ballpark.

Oddly enough: I just discovered the closest dealer to me (Ottawa) has five 2014 (!!) model Mirages (the top trim, manual shift) that are "new cars selling as used" with a few hundred km on each of them for $10k.
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Latest mods test: 15 mods = 15% MPG improvement: A-B test, 2007 Honda Civic 1.8L, 5-speed
Ecodriving test:
Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown: Nissan Micra 1.6L



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www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
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Old 10-07-2016, 02:26 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I know those deals were there on the 2015 and I think I see $1500 or $1750 rebates on the 2017 but did the base price make a jump on the 2017? It really isn't a good choice for me as a new car anyway as we don't have a dealer here which makes the warranty less attractive. We did buy a Kia once even though at the time they didn't have a dealer. At least they paid to have it towed 200 miles but I still had to go pick it up. It would be even cooler if they had a warranty waiver option for another $1000 off but I suppose that's dreaming.
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Old 10-08-2016, 04:34 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I looked the MSRP. The 2017 base manual is only $25 more then the 2015 base manual. That's pretty awesome, 2 years, a redesign, and only $25 more.
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Old 10-09-2016, 09:11 AM   #20 (permalink)
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I looked at those 2014s still on the lot at the Bank Street dealer, $10K on a car that was $15.4K, not a bad markdown at all. At that point I don't think I'd even haggle, I'd just pay it and drive away.

Bank Street still has 5 of the unused 2014s to sell, so if you're looking for a bargain that's a good one, I think.

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