Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Fossil Fuel Free
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 09-03-2012, 09:37 AM   #41 (permalink)
Administrator
 
Daox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Germantown, WI
Posts: 11,203

CM400E - '81 Honda CM400E
90 day: 51.49 mpg (US)

Daox's Grey Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
Team Toyota
90 day: 49.53 mpg (US)

Daox's Insight - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 64.33 mpg (US)

Swarthy - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage DE
Mitsubishi
90 day: 56.69 mpg (US)

Daox's Volt - '13 Chevrolet Volt
Thanks: 2,501
Thanked 2,587 Times in 1,554 Posts
Where are you going to get this 36V from? A dc/dc converter?

I think 36V is still much too low. If your motor is rated for 1.5hp continuous at 95V, you have roughly 1/3rd that hp available at 36V, so only .5hp. I'd guess you need around 1hp at least to run the A/C. Therefore, I'd run it at at least ~63V (95*.66), and get a pulley to make your rpms at the compressor to what they would have been at idle or slightly above with the OEM engine. You can fairly accurately estimate the rpms by looking at the stock volts per rpm specs. At 95V you get 6750 rpm, or 71rpm/V. So, at 63V you would get 4475 rpm. I did these same calculations when I put the PM motor in my riding lawn tractor and it worked out great.

__________________
Current project: A better alternator delete
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 09-03-2012, 10:12 AM   #42 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 442
Thanks: 1
Thanked 60 Times in 45 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daox View Post
Where are you going to get this 36V from? A dc/dc converter?

I think 36V is still much too low. If your motor is rated for 1.5hp continuous at 95V, you have roughly 1/3rd that hp available at 36V, so only .5hp. I'd guess you need around 1hp at least to run the A/C. Therefore, I'd run it at at least ~63V (95*.66), and get a pulley to make your rpms at the compressor to what they would have been at idle or slightly above with the OEM engine. You can fairly accurately estimate the rpms by looking at the stock volts per rpm specs. At 95V you get 6750 rpm, or 71rpm/V. So, at 63V you would get 4475 rpm. I did these same calculations when I put the PM motor in my riding lawn tractor and it worked out great.
It's about the RPMs of the motor and what these little guys can really handle before the brushes spark. I tried 48v and 36 volts with the 3" pulley and 36 volts ran much nicer on the pulley and the A/C compressor was operating, blowing cold air into the hot car.

I am building a small 50 AMP motor controller that will take pack voltage (144v), I'll be making the compact PCB this week.
__________________
Civic EV http://2001-civic-ev.blogspot.com/
Solectria Force http://solectriaforce.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2012, 02:50 PM   #43 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
NeilBlanchard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,907

Mica Blue - '05 Scion xA RS 2.0
Team Toyota
90 day: 42.48 mpg (US)

Forest - '15 Nissan Leaf S
Team Nissan
90 day: 156.46 mpg (US)

Number 7 - '15 VW e-Golf SEL
TEAM VW AUDI Group
90 day: 155.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,475
Thanked 2,950 Times in 1,844 Posts
The folks at Illuminati Motor Works would tell you not use a clutch. They (probably) would have won the X-Prize if they had not used a clutch. They just use the car in either 3rd gear (better acceleration) or 4th gear (about 2% better efficiency).
__________________
Sincerely, Neil

http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2012, 03:12 PM   #44 (permalink)
Administrator
 
Daox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Germantown, WI
Posts: 11,203

CM400E - '81 Honda CM400E
90 day: 51.49 mpg (US)

Daox's Grey Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
Team Toyota
90 day: 49.53 mpg (US)

Daox's Insight - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 64.33 mpg (US)

Swarthy - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage DE
Mitsubishi
90 day: 56.69 mpg (US)

Daox's Volt - '13 Chevrolet Volt
Thanks: 2,501
Thanked 2,587 Times in 1,554 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSGC View Post
It's about the RPMs of the motor and what these little guys can really handle before the brushes spark. I tried 48v and 36 volts with the 3" pulley and 36 volts ran much nicer on the pulley and the A/C compressor was operating, blowing cold air into the hot car.

I am building a small 50 AMP motor controller that will take pack voltage (144v), I'll be making the compact PCB this week.
If you're building a controller why even worry about what voltage to run it at? Just tweak the duty cycle and you're set.
__________________
Current project: A better alternator delete
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2012, 03:14 PM   #45 (permalink)
Administrator
 
Daox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Germantown, WI
Posts: 11,203

CM400E - '81 Honda CM400E
90 day: 51.49 mpg (US)

Daox's Grey Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
Team Toyota
90 day: 49.53 mpg (US)

Daox's Insight - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 64.33 mpg (US)

Swarthy - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage DE
Mitsubishi
90 day: 56.69 mpg (US)

Daox's Volt - '13 Chevrolet Volt
Thanks: 2,501
Thanked 2,587 Times in 1,554 Posts
There isn't anything wrong with using a clutch. It just has to be rated for the torque output of your motor. So, you just have to be aware that motors can put out a NICE amount of torque. There should be amp/torque charts for the ADC motor he is using and he should be able to size his clutch accordingly.
__________________
Current project: A better alternator delete
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2012, 03:37 PM   #46 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
HyperMileQC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Laval, QC
Posts: 528

Trollinsight (Retired) - '00 Honda Insight
Team Honda
Gen-1 Insights
90 day: 68.06 mpg (US)

Redsight - '01 Honda Insight
Team Honda
Gen-1 Insights

Carole - '05 Toyota Corolla Xrs
Team Toyota

Brise-Fer - '05 Toyota Echo
Team Toyota
Thanks: 311
Thanked 93 Times in 69 Posts
Send a message via MSN to HyperMileQC
A Manual EV? Subscribing now!
__________________
Trollinsight Modding Thread

2000 Honda Insight MT Silverstone Metallic #95 (CAN) 131K mi. 81.7 Lmpg
Best Tank : 100.06 MPG (US) | 120.2 MPG (Imp) | 2.35 L/100Km | 42.54 Km/L
Best commute : 130.8 MPG (US) | 157.1 MPG (Imp) | 1.8 L/100Km | 54.84 Km/L
Best Trip : 111.8 MPG (US) | 134.3 MPG (Imp) | 2.1 L/100Km | 47.53 Km/L
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2012, 03:47 PM   #47 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
mechman600's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Langley, BC
Posts: 1,228

Fusion - '16 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
Thanks: 190
Thanked 275 Times in 168 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard View Post
The folks at Illuminati Motor Works would tell you not use a clutch. They (probably) would have won the X-Prize if they had not used a clutch. They just use the car in either 3rd gear (better acceleration) or 4th gear (about 2% better efficiency).
The clutch/no clutch debate is hotly contested on DIY EV forums. The arguments never seem to mention efficiency, because clutches are pretty well 100% efficient (when fully engaged). The only inefficiency may be the added inertia of the flywheel and clutch assembly that may hinder acceleration a tiny bit, but since this isn't the X-Prize, it is probably irrelevant.

The "pro-clutch" people seem to like clutches not because of shifting (although it is a nice bonus to be able to shift normally), but because of the added safety measure - being able to disconnect in the event of a runaway. (The event that will change your pants from green to brown in about 2 seconds).

If you have the skills to incorporate a clutch, then I advise taking that route. If not, then the no-clutch route is simpler and easier and nearly as good, just as long as you make sure your HV system has plenty of safety redundency in case of the dreaded runaway.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to mechman600 For This Useful Post:
rubicon209 (09-05-2012)
Old 09-04-2012, 06:14 PM   #48 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 442
Thanks: 1
Thanked 60 Times in 45 Posts
It was easier for me to play with the treadmill motor using the batteries I have before I make a controller.

As for the clutch debate, it was simple: the adapter I made for my previous AutoTranny EV mimics the engine hub, so it was as simple as bolting the flywheel, clutch and pressure plate to my existing adapter. No machining, no designing, just mount and go. I also need to shift due to the gear ratios of my manual transmission.

Yesterday we started building the control tray and test fitted a few parts:



The weather is quite awful now so I have no clue what will get done in the next few days. I am going to try and finish bolting the control tray mounts then hookup the heater when the rain stops. The end of this week looks better for the weather so hopefully I will be wiring this weekend!
__________________
Civic EV http://2001-civic-ev.blogspot.com/
Solectria Force http://solectriaforce.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2012, 06:29 PM   #49 (permalink)
Administrator
 
Daox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Germantown, WI
Posts: 11,203

CM400E - '81 Honda CM400E
90 day: 51.49 mpg (US)

Daox's Grey Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
Team Toyota
90 day: 49.53 mpg (US)

Daox's Insight - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 64.33 mpg (US)

Swarthy - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage DE
Mitsubishi
90 day: 56.69 mpg (US)

Daox's Volt - '13 Chevrolet Volt
Thanks: 2,501
Thanked 2,587 Times in 1,554 Posts
Have you figured out what you're going to do for balancing the pack?
__________________
Current project: A better alternator delete
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2012, 06:39 PM   #50 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 442
Thanks: 1
Thanked 60 Times in 45 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daox View Post
Have you figured out what you're going to do for balancing the pack?
I have my eye on the MiniBMS at the moment. I am thinking about getting the MiniBMS and then letting my Elcon 2000w charge them up and measure each cell, I am only aiming for 3.55v/cell charging, but I can bump it up if I want too.

__________________
Civic EV http://2001-civic-ev.blogspot.com/
Solectria Force http://solectriaforce.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread






Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com