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Old 09-27-2018, 05:18 PM   #1901 (permalink)
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Old 09-27-2018, 05:28 PM   #1902 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Lee View Post
Why aren't these cons punished like any other crook? Oh... wait... any other non-white collar crook.
White collar crime is harder to prove than straight thief. You have to prove intent not just possession.

To successfully prosecute Paul Elio for fraud you would have to prove that he never intended to deliver customer vehicles when he took the deposits. His basic defense would be incompetence.

It would be easy if Elio took the money and ran but he didn't do that. Instead he took the money and pissed it away trying to keep his under capitalized company afloat.
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Old 09-27-2018, 07:49 PM   #1903 (permalink)
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How about if people just charged Paul Elio with "Tucker-ism" marketing fraud?
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Old 09-28-2018, 10:00 AM   #1904 (permalink)
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Isn't "marketing fraud" redundant?
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Old 09-28-2018, 10:44 AM   #1905 (permalink)
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Quote:
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It would be easy if Elio took the money and ran but he didn't do that. Instead he took the money and pissed it away trying to keep his under capitalized company afloat.
Pretty much. Pissed it away trying to develop everything but the tires in house so they can put the proprietary lock down on every nut and bolt.

Elio isn't going to be as big as they thought. The only chance they had to really take off was to sub almost everything out, get it built fast and get them out for sale while gas prices were still nearly $3.80 per gallon for most of the country.
But that ship has sailed.

Gas prices will be back around $4 a gallon again, but not before elio is long gone.
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Old 09-28-2018, 01:09 PM   #1906 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Tele man View Post
How about if people just charged Paul Elio with "Tucker-ism" marketing fraud?
Indivudual backers will imho hardly take the trouble with lawsuit, the deposit was so low they will rather write it off (and keep the t-shirt).
Government supported funds that gave Elio millions in grants? Maybe. But, after first assessment they will realize there is not much to confiscate should they eventually win the case. Why bother with paying for lawyers than?

In the end, Elio in fact did a good job and his true bussiness is well executed.
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Old 09-28-2018, 02:07 PM   #1907 (permalink)
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Isn't Elio the company that emerged out of a government prize for building a efficient vehicle? I thought the whole goal was to make money by building something cheap so that it doesn't cut into the prize money profits?

Elio cars will never be a thing. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I don't think these "inventors" are so much interested in developing compelling technology so much as making a profit.

EDIT: I was thinking of Edison2. For some reason I thought they were the same vehicle, but the Edison2 has 4 wheels.

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Old 09-28-2018, 03:53 PM   #1908 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
Isn't Elio the company that emerged out of a government prize for building a efficient vehicle? I thought the whole goal was to make money by building something cheap so that it doesn't cut into the prize money profits?

Elio cars will never be a thing. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I don't think these "inventors" are so much interested in developing compelling technology so much as making a profit.

EDIT: I was thinking of Edison2. For some reason I thought they were the same vehicle, but the Edison2 has 4 wheels.

Yes, Elio is a different horse in this on-going "Dog & Pony" marketing scheme. Edison2 shut themselves down.
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Old 09-28-2018, 04:32 PM   #1909 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Yes, Elio is a different horse in this on-going "Dog & Pony" marketing scheme. Edison2 shut themselves down.
It seemed pretty evident to me that Edison2 was a money grab. They also developed in wheel suspension that appeared to be a money grab; just trying to market the patent and sell it to some sucker willing to buy it.

Maybe there is a market for Elio in Florida. If I wanted a small crappy car, I'd buy a Smart.
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Old 09-28-2018, 04:35 PM   #1910 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
Isn't Elio the company that emerged out of a government prize for building a efficient vehicle? I thought the whole goal was to make money by building something cheap so that it doesn't cut into the prize money profits?

Elio cars will never be a thing. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I don't think these "inventors" are so much interested in developing compelling technology so much as making a profit.

EDIT: I was thinking of Edison2. For some reason I thought they were the same vehicle, but the Edison2 has 4 wheels.

Right - Edison2 was a totally different animal. 250cc turbo single cylinder rear wheel drive, seats 4 people, super low aero drag - VERY different designs.

Edison could not have been a money grab - they built 10 prototypes before the X-Prize, and they brought 4 cars. They spent FAR more money than the prize money. They were always a genuine effort to build a 100+ MPG car.

They won the "main" prize of $5 Million. They probably spend $15 Million, or more. They also built an electric version after the X-Prize, and they continued to develop the design, took it to the GM wind tunnel, and started building the production intent prototype. They continued for about 4 years after the X-Prize.

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